Carrying on from this (http://sinisterdesign.freepowerboards.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1912) very popular thread, share your ideas of what enemies you'd like to see in TSoG!
There were many very interesting ideas for enemies being thrown around, as well as ideas for completing enemy sets (e.g. having a White Cape enemy, to come along with the Blue Cape and Black Capes from the Psy Academy Map Editor enemy set), and some of them have made it into the Telepath series games already (e.g. Tigs, Greater Ghost)! Hence, do share and show off your creativity!
The best ideas will go into this (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=27.0) thread. ;)
The easiest format, along with a descirption of the enemy, includes giving suggested stats and attacks:
e.g. an enemy suggestion by im2smart4u:
Mine Stats:
Health: 20
Speed: 0
Attacks: Explosion (Range: Omnidirectional+self, Damage: 25)
Counter-attack: Explosion (Range: Omnidirectional+self, Damage: 25)
Immunity: Mental
Hero's Shadow
Health: same as hero
Speed: same as hero
Attacks: same as hero
Counters: same as hero
and other stats: same as hero
Description: a darker version of you, allowing you to take on the greatest enemy in the game. The gold reward could be dependent upon your level. as all the stats would be loaded form the autosave's hero the programming would be relatively easy. This character could be faced in some dark crypt born from ancient dark magics, created by the shadowlings as either an enemy meant to destroy you or as a trainer meant to test you to the limit of your abilities. The character could also be a mechanical monstrosity created by the mechanics.
Intersting, but I don't think that quite fits in with the atmosphere of Telepath games. There was, however, an idea to pit the Main from TRPG2 against the Hero from TRPG3 (aka TSoG).
Ah, well, it was just a passing thought as I'm starting to tire from laying waste to all opposition with one attack...
By all means keep on sharing these ;)
I have to point out though that in the full game you'll probably not have such a well-trained team at the point: quite a lot of people, after playing the game for some time, start complaining that it gets too easy, but then again, with this being an unfinished demo, many simply overtrain their Hero and the teammates, hence the ease of disposal of the enemies.
If you want, try playing through the game again from scratch without overtrainig your teammates- that might give you a fresher look on the difficulty of TSoG.
Shadow bug Guardian
Health: 70
Speed: 5
Attacks: Venomous Bite (Range-1 space in front. Damage-40)
Counter-attack: Slash (Same as normal slash. Damage-30)
Immunity: Shadow
Ok, I think the "Guardian" part of the name may be changed a little, but I certainly think that having an addition to the Shadow-Bug enemy set mitgh be nice, with a bug that could do a counter-attack (even melee would do). I wonder though what type of bug would that be? As we have the Queen, the Nymphs and the standard Shadow BUgs themselves. Anyone got ideas for some fitting names?
I do like the idea of having an "upgraded" version of the Shadow Bug, including higher damage and elemental immunity. Somethink akin to "veteran" in the name, maybe?
Just a passing thought, but what if a ghost bound itself to an item, say a weapon?
Nice idea, I do believe that the idea is partially manifested in the Jinn's present in the game, like Iblis (bound to a statue, a very powerful enemy boss at that!).
how about instead of shadow bug, you call it darkness bug or something along that line, so it can relate to the shadow bug but still be a separate unit?
how about an Abyss Bug, or a Void bug?
I like the abyss name better than void because you think void and its just a big nothing but you think abyss and you think dark mysterious.
See, I thought shadow bug guardian would be a good name because they could be for guarding their nests, or the queen.
Well, there is already a Shadowling Guardian, so that's a bit of a repetition. I prefer void bug over abyss bug myself.
I also imagine this kind of bug to be quite old, with a touch of grey, for which I think of Gloom Bug or Dusk Bug, though that doesn't sound quite as good. How about Night Bug or Twilight Bug?
Also, given that the Shadow Bug enemy set is a medium difficulty one, I think this bug be better equipped with a non-area attack, but quite a powerful one none-the-less. How about Double Strike worth 18 damage? And then Melee as a counterattack for 11 damage? I think that would be quite nice, as the enemy would then formally have 2 attacks.
Come to think of it, with regards to the original proposed name, why not drop Shadow and keep it simply Guardian Bug? Given that the bugs also have a queen, that might be a nice parallel to have!
And I am definitely for expanding the Shadow Bug set: this could allow for more variety in map making with regards to the Shadow Bugs (and maybe party use that in the Gelf side quest ;) ).
I like guardian bug if its only going to appear when you fight queen bugs. I think that if it shows up other places it should have a different name like void,abyss or night bug.
That's an interesting point, though I guess the guardian bugs can be employed anywhere and they're really there to protect the colony. Given the debate between im2smart4u and the random one, we're still undecided whether to see them more as spiders or as ants.
whatever they are I will think of them as creepy or annoying depending on my lvl.
I think the abyss/guardian/void bug is a good idea.
But I think another new enemy should be White Shadowlings, sorta like Nelis or Tastiadan.
White Shadowling:
Health: 80
Attacks: Mind Blast (Damage: 13) and Light Blast (Damage: 20)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: Shadow
Counter-Attack: None
White Shadowling Elite:
Health: 120
Attacks: Mind Blast (Damage: 17), Light Blast (Damage: 24 Range:2), Shockwave (Damage: 20 Omnidirectional Range: 2), and Holy Blast (Damage: 26, Damage to all: 2)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: Shadow
Counter-Attack: Mindblast
Make their eyes blue and bodys white or something like that. Eliltes have bonemasks.
"White Shadows" hunh... I thought of them more are the ghosts...
Is this the what you guys are going for?:
Shadow Bug ==> Abyss/Guardian/Void Bug
Ravinale Swordsman ==> Ravinale Myrmidon
Ravinale Spearman ==> Ravinale Elite
Ravinale Bowman ==> Ravinale Sniper
Quote from: Frosty on February 13, 2010, 07:55:22 PM
White Shadowling:
Health: 80
Attacks: Mind Blast (Damage: 13) and Light Blast (Damage: 20)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: Shadow
White Shadowling Elite:
Health: 120
Attacks: Mind Blast (Damage: 17), Light Blast (Damage: 24 Range:2), Shockwave (Damage: 20 Omnidirectional Range: 2), and Holy Blast (Damage: 26, Damage to all: 2)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: Shadow
Counter-Attack: Mindblast
Make their eyes blue and bodys white or something like that. Eliltes have bonemasks.
They are
Shadowlings, so that means they use the
Shadow Element.
Thorny Vines is what the name implies. This Destructible Battlefield Object will only hurt players, if the player attacks it first.
Thorny Vines:
Health: 30
Speed: 0
Attacks: none
Counter-attacks: Prick (Range: 1, Damage: 5)
Immunity: Mental
You don't need a knife to be an Assassin. Some humans use their speed and stealth alongside their psy powers to dispatch enemy units. (you can play human psy assassin in the Dual mode of TPRG2)
Psy Assassin
Health: 50
Speed: 4
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 10), Feedback (Range: 2, Healing/Damage: 15)
The thorny vines seems like a pretty neat idea. It would really be annoying if you had to take a spot that was occupied by thorns.
I think there already are psy assassins.
I was reading the story The Reign of Nelis the Merciless. I was wondering if you could have a golem similar to the cannon golem in the story. It would able to attack units from a rooftop and keep relatively safe. It would be quite annoying to kill.
Cannon Golem: Health: 33
Speed: 1
Attack: (I know I need a better name)
Spike Shot: Range: 2 Damage: 10
Quote from: yogc on February 14, 2010, 09:56:59 PM
I was reading the story The Reign of Nelis the Merciless. I was wondering if you could have a golem similar to the cannon golem in the story. It would able to attack units from a rooftop and keep relatively safe. It would be quite annoying to kill.
Cannon Golem: Health: 33
Speed: 1
Attack: (I know I need a better name)
Spike Shot: Range: 2 Damage: 10
how about "Cannon Blast"?
Quote from: im2smart4u on February 14, 2010, 11:59:12 AM
They are
Shadowlings, so that means they use the
Shadow Element
Nelis and Tastiadan don't use shadow, and every rule has some exeptions.
I agree with im2smart4u here: the idea of a Shadowling using a different element has been discussed, but the general feeling was that it didn't make that much sense. Tastidian and Nelis are the most powerful Shadowling Psys out there, Tastidian has Shadwo resistance, only because they're such powerful Psys can they learn attacks of another element. Making a common enemy with another element will be belittling their uniqueness, to say the least. Also, Spriggats are also element-bound, so why shouldn't the Shadowlings all have Shadow affinity (note that it only implies easier-to-master attacks of certain elements, and isn't excluding all others, just making attacks of other elements insanely difficult to learn for anyone, but the most powerful representatives of the race).
A counter-attack only battlefield object is an interesting tactical addition: after all, one can use it to one's advanatge by attacking it and forcing it to inflict damage on your teammate and any other enemy within range (as a must-have add on in description: "use with caution" ;) ). I like the idea.
Psy Assassin: why not, why not- having a mobile enemy with Feedback will be a nie challenge, plus the enemy type was featured in TRPG2 Psy Duel mode, which would be a nice reference for those who truly explored the Telepath universe. It seems feasible that during the journeys around Cera Bella the Hero can encounter at least one Himan Psy Assassin.
Given how the game will be of a certain quality, I am still hopefull that the Shadowling Assassin will also make it into the game, as it will be quite nice to have an enemy that cannot be easily cornered and can backstab (via Shadowport 2) at any opportunity- a very powerful opponent, methinks.
The "Guardian/VOid BUg" seems to be getting general approval. Thus, what name should be given to the unit?
Here is the latest suggestion of the stats for the bug:
Health: 70
Speed: 5
Attacks: Double Strike (Range-1 space in front. Damage-18)
Counter-attack: Melee (Same as normal slash. Damage-9 or 11)
Immunity: Shadow
What do you think of health: is that too high? Methinks the damage can be roughly within twice the range of what a usual Shadow Bug can do. Also, Double Strike seems fitting as it shows that the Guardian Bug is more experienced and over the years learned how to strike at the enemy much faster. Thoughts, folks?
I decided the Cannon Golem would be too easy to kill with Rahel, so I gave it a longer ranged attack.
Cannon Golem: Health: 33
Speed: 1
Attack: Cannon Blast: Range: 2 Damage: 10
Cannon Blast 2: Range: 3 Damage: 10
yeah I think that's good KZ , maybe his speed should be lower because since he's been around longer he would move slower what do you think?
Oh, woops, I accidently didn't set the speed right: the speed should read 3, to make it easier for CraigStern to simply adopt alerady-existing AI (as most work on speed 3).
In my opinion, those bugs are still in their prime, jsut simply more experienced, not yet beginning to wane, hunters.
Thus,here is the amended version:
The "Guardian/VOid BUg" seems to be getting general approval. Thus, what name should be given to the unit?
Here is the latest suggestion of the stats for the bug:
Health: 70
Speed: 3
Attacks: Double Strike (Range-1 space in front. Damage-18)
Counter-attack: Melee (Same as normal slash. Damage-9 or 11)
Immunity: Shadow
I'd like to hear opinions from a few more of view before posting this in the formulated enemy ideas thread (just so that we all agree and like this ;) ).
Assuming the Guardian/Void bug appears only where there is a colony/ a queen, then I think they should be called guardian bugs.
If the guardian/void bug will appear just as an "upgrade" to the shadow bug, then I think the name guardian bug wouldn't make sense. For example, it wouldn't have made sense in TRPG 2 if the "shadowling guardians" had appeared outside of Somnus. It depends on how you use them.
KZ seems to want some sort of veteran bug, I'm looking for a big buff soldier bug. You know, there are small ants, fire ants, ants that fly, and giant soldier ants.
It seems that you are looking for an upgrade to the shadow bug, sort of how a sniper is an upgrade from a marksman. In that cases, void bug would seem more fitting, since the void bug would not necessarily have to guard a nest.
Well, if it's down to the name, than give your preferences, folks! For me both "guardian" or "void" will do just fine. I'm looking for an upgrade to the shadow bug, manifested in a very experienced, yet still healthy and strong, shadow bug. The role of the bug can be to defend the colony in case of great stress, not only to protect the Shadowbug Queen, but, say, repel any major invasions or try to rescue the nest from natural disasters by, for instance, evacuating Nymphs and wounded Shadow Bugs (veteran bugs will probably be strong enough to lift them). And one can explain their absence in the deepder downs by saying that it's a relatively new colony there and that the bugs generally don't live next to lava, but given how the Shadowlings started on-land war, were forced to migrate northwards, where it's more calm.
Quote from: yogc on February 18, 2010, 06:45:18 PM
It seems that you are looking for an upgrade to the shadow bug, sort of how a sniper is an upgrade from a marksman. In that cases, void bug would seem more fitting, since the void bug would not necessarily have to guard a nest.
Guardian bugs can be anywhere, to intercept attackers or the whatnot, they don't have to stay next to the nest.
And KZ, why not just make a guardian and a void bug. To me, void bug sounds like it would actually use dark vortex or shadow blast. But I suppose making both of them would be confusing, since everything only usually has one upgrade. And putting both in would delay the game longer.
Quote from: im2smart4u on February 14, 2010, 07:17:47 PM
Thorny Vines is what the name implies. This Destructible Battlefield Object will only hurt players, if the player attacks it first.
Thorny Vines:
Health: 30
Speed: 0
Attacks: none
Counter-attacks: Prick (Range: 1, Damage: 5)
Immunity: Mental
You don't need a knife to be an Assassin. Some humans use their speed and stealth alongside their psy powers to dispatch enemy units. (you can play human psy assassin in the Dual mode of TPRG2)
Psy Assassin
Health: 50
Speed: 4
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 10), Feedback (Range: 2, Healing/Damage: 15)
Quote from: yogc on February 14, 2010, 09:48:01 PM
The thorny vines seems like a pretty neat idea. It would really be annoying if you had to take a spot that was occupied by thorns.
I think there already are psy assassins.
Yes, there is a shadowling Psy Assassin class, but there isn't any enemy Psy Assassins. A shadowling Psy Assassin has already been Formulated (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=27.0), but the human Psy Assassin has not.
spirit tastidian
health:250
speed:5
atacks:mind blast shadow blast dark vortex
counter:none
tastidian as a ghost bound to the world regretting ever losing the shadow war and mistaking you for the hero of rpg chapter 1 and 2
Quote from: torugo on February 21, 2010, 05:50:21 PM
spirit tastidian
health:250
speed:5
atacks:mind blast shadow blast dark vortex
counter:none
tastidian as a ghost bound to the world regretting ever losing the shadow war and mistaking you for the hero of rpg chapter 1 and 2
Why would Tastidain be in a Crypt? Why is Tastidian faster then Assassins like Al'al? Who says shadowlings can be spirits?
im2smart4u has a point. Most shadowlings already look like ghosts. And Tastiadan could easily tell you weren't the main character from the first 2, they wore a black cape and had red hair. On the other hand, the main character in TRGPsog has a brown cape and black hair. How could the two be mixed up? Plus Tastiadan uses light attacks, as said earlier by me, defending one of my ideas I realized how crappy it was way to late.
Let's settle on Void Bug then, as it seems to cater to both possibilities, as a Void Bug can guard the queen and perform other tasks necessary at times of great peril.
So, just to have a final summation, anyone wants to add any final thoughts before this goes to forumlated?
Void Bug
Health: 70
Speed: 3
Attacks: Double Strike (Range-1 space in front. Damage-18)
Counter-attack: Melee (Same as normal slash. Damage-9 or 11)
Immunity: Shadow
I also like the human Psy Assassin idea, it sort of cross-links with the proposed Black Cape, but doesn't interfere- they can be graduates of the Psy Academy who left the institution to pursue "freelance" work. Furthermore, this unit has been in the Psy Duel mode, and it's nice to link up to it, methinks. How many of you folks would like to see this unit added into formulated?
Same goes for Thorny Vines- thaving a counter-attacking battlefield object will allow for variety in the game.
i gave the idea of tasdidian having dark atacks to make him more threatening and none knows his true health or speed because its hidden when you fight him so i took a guess
what else would happen to a shadowling when it dies
why not put him in a crypt they got spirits of all sorts of other things and there needs to be a good fight in this one
if luca cant remember her husbands name and azma cant even remember the debt of fizooz than tasdidian might have forgotten what the old hero looks like. spirits have terrible memmorys
Quote from: torugo on February 22, 2010, 04:44:27 PM
i gave the idea of tasdidian having dark atacks to make him more threatening and none knows his true health or speed because its hidden when you fight him so i took a guess
what else would happen to a shadowling when it dies
why not put him in a crypt they got spirits of all sorts of other things and there needs to be a good fight in this one
First of all, spirits use cold attacks, and your going to give a spirit shadow attacks? Even though he originally used light?
Quote from: torugo on February 22, 2010, 04:46:35 PM
if luca cant remember her husbands name and azma cant even remember the debt of fizooz than tasdidian might have forgotten what the old hero looks like. spirits have terrible memmorys
They have good enough memorys to even remember what Fizooz looked like, even though hes a spirit and looks different. Either way, he could just scan you to figure out.
Quote from: KZ on February 22, 2010, 06:12:25 AM
I also like the human Psy Assassin idea, it sort of cross-links with the proposed Black Cape, but doesn't interfere- they can be graduates of the Psy Academy who left the institution to pursue "freelance" work. Furthermore, this unit has been in the Psy Duel mode, and it's nice to link up to it, methinks. How many of you folks would like to see this unit added into formulated?
Same goes for Thorny Vines- thaving a counter-attacking battlefield object will allow for variety in the game.
I do think you should formulate them both, and make white caped assasins, only they train the mental affinity farther instead of assasination. Only thing I could think of to add was vengence.
first i recommend a boss like this because the other crypts went by to fast and we at least need some kind of good fight in the end
second this is not my game so i cant add that stuff in that is for the original creator to do im just trying to come up with ideas
Maybe a boss in the Crypts is a good idea, but Spirit Tastiadan just has a weird feel to it. But I do suppose it might be better than my white shadowlings. Sorry about that, KZ made me realize why that was a horrible idea.
And KZ, you overdid the speed again.
how about Zeitgiset (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeitgeist) as a name for a crypt ghost boss?
That's a start, but now we need stats. I think it should be close to this:
Zeitgest
Health: 75
Speed: 4
Attacks: Mind Blast (Damage:15), Cyro Blast (Damage:23), Cyro Cross (Damage:21), Some Third Cold Attack (Damage:?)
Resistance: Cold
Immunity: Physical
Counter: Mind Blast
health: 75
speed: 4
atacks: pyro blast pyro hail pyro protect cryo blast cryo cross
counter: burn if pyro protect is used
resistance:cold
cutlists that have pyrokinetic abilities like fernatis but not as powerful
common version of fernatis.
Now it is in the right spot, and that is an ok idea, only there are already acolytes, which this could just be an improv off of.
Since I my proposed golem has been the center of attention these past few pages, I decided to post it again. ;)
Cannon Golem: Health: 33
Speed: 1
Attack: Cannon Blast: Range: 2 Damage: 10
Cannon Blast 2: Range: 3 Damage: 10
I chose for the health to be between that of an energy golem and a stone golem.
As a side note, even though I got the idea from Barzul's "The Reign of Nelis the Merciless", it doesn't mean the golem would have to be a carbon copy of the golem in the story (basically, it shouldn't be invincible from all sides except for one of its arms). I just got the idea from the story.
Interesting idea, yogc, but I'd like to direct your attention to the formulated enemy ideas thread- during autumn there has been a lot of activity withe respect to new golem units, especially for Helenites, and several were proposed, with a few (two, I think), making it into the selected list- I think that there might be a bit of overlap with those suggestions, what do you think? (That isn't to say that I don't like the idea, just that there might be some overlap with things discussed and already suggested. Though a ranged golem is a nice addition.)
KZ, good point as usual. I just wanted to make sure that with all the excitement around the void bugs my topic wouldn't be forgotten.
There are a lot of golems, but there really isn't a mid-range golem. All the others are either close up or attack from across the screen (and can't even move).
I'm behind the Cannon Golem idea all the way. A healthy Goliath of an archer is a great idea.^^
I have to admit that a mid-ranged golem is an appealing idea: I have thought that this aspect is a big plus when I was writing my previous post. The one thing I am not too keen on is the choice of projectile, for some reason (I cannot give a logical explanation for that, as it desont' even clash a bit with technological tree). I definitely like the range/health/damage stats. Just as a tentative alternative, how about using arrows? Or rough boulders (seems like at that stage, it would be more appropriate for folks to use them, but that's just a style preference)?
So instead of Cannon Blast, you'd rather it be named, Boulder Toss
The suggestion about the wooden golem has similarities with the canon golem... either one is a good idea IMO.
Before I read this thread, I replied to the post by im2smart4u about his Bug Theory (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=74.msg1231#msg1231). At that time I was thinking about a bug similar to the proposed Void Bugs (I called it Soldier Bug). So, I must say I'm in favour of it's existence. About the name, a few more came to mind: Murk Bug, Darkness Bug, Crypt Bug, Obscurity Bug, or just Soldier Bug.
Quote from: im2smart4u on February 14, 2010, 07:17:47 PM
You don't need a knife to be an Assassin. Some humans use their speed and stealth alongside their psy powers to dispatch enemy units. (you can play human psy assassin in the Dual mode of TPRG2)
Psy Assassin
Health: 50
Speed: 4
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 10), Feedback (Range: 2, Healing/Damage: 15)
Does anyone think that the human Psy Assassin shouldn't be Formulated (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=27.0)?
After being recruited by the Assassin's Cult, the Spriggat Assassins (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=114.0) are trained to move faster then they ever could. This new boost in speed will allow them to sneak behind enemy lines and simultaneously hit two targets from behind.
Frost Assassin:
Health: 48
Speed: 4
Attacks: Frost Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 10)
Resistance: Cold
Red Assassin:
Health: 42
Speed: 4
Attacks: Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: Heat
Given that there were Spriggat Assassins in TRPG2, I don't see why not, especially as the speed 4 boost is there as well. But then there will be 3 units that look exactly the same- I think that the players might find that a bit annoying.
Give the Spriggats something to stand out with, like a little noticable difference from spriggats to spriggat healers.
I like the new assassin ideas. I think they should be formulated
About the golem: I just can't picture a golem firing arrows. A bow, even a crossbow, seems to delicate for a huge golem to use. Maybe boulders would work.
By elves, do you mean gelf? Introducing a new race would be very hard to pull off. They would need history, characters, and maybe (almost certainly) a few more stuff.
Elves?
Elves?
Elves?
No. Probably the least original idea ever thought of. Tolkien made elves. Now let's let him have his elves.
And we can have something elves.
I'm sorry but Telepath has a history of creating races that are quite unique. Elves... simply don't cut it, the closest elfish thing I would ever support in Telepath are the Gelf
Having a tall beautiful archer-nature race is...
elf
...even if you call it an asdf
I also don't like the idea of having one character (that is not the hero) that can be adept in many skills. That seriously limits strategy.
How about this:
Mechanic Rifleman:
Though production, limited resources, and the complex design of Cera Bella firearms had confined gun-making to an art confined to small workshops, crossbows and psy being superior in every way, the first riflemen have completed their training and are now being tried in the field. The Mechanics have surely outdone themselves with their versatile gun.
Health: 28
PsP: 25 (if Craig decides to have AI's have limited PsP)
Speed: 3
Attacks:
Melee--Str\1.5+1+Lvl Range 1
Snipe--5PsP, Str+0.5PA+3+1.5lvl Range 2
Suppressive Fire--7PsP, 0.75Str+3+0.8Lvl, Subtracts speed of rifleman by 2 for the next 2 turns, subtracts 3 speed off targets for two turns. Range 1-3
Resistance: Light
Immunity: None
Made that up on the spot and its more original than elves.
How About This Idea Then:
Mechanic Blimp:
After a seris of tests and many failures, The Mechanics have created a blimp. This Blimp can fly because it is made from light materials and filled with a highly flammible air found in the deeper downs. These blimps carry minerals that have been compressed together in the Deeper Downs, what when are dropped create an explosion. These Blimp can carry people and burn extra gas in the blimp to move farther.
Health: 40
PsP: 20
Speed: 2 (Flying)
Attacks:
Bomb Bombardment: Cost 5 PsP, Range 3 (Backwards), Damage [Psy Power+( Level X 2)]
Suicide Bomber: Cost 10 PsP, Range Omidirectional + Self, Damage [Psy Power+7+Level] (Note: When Move Is Done, Blimp is Destoryed)
Gas Burner: Cost 5 PsP, Range Self, Increases movement by 2
Carry: 5 PsP, Range 1, Picks up Unit and drops it off at end of Blimp's Movement
Resistance: None
I'm not sure the "moving characters with a blimp" thing is good, but the idea of the mechanics having a flying support is a great idea..
yeah I agree the flying support sounds good. as for the sniper I think if youe get rid of the melee and lower his health a bit then it would be a bit better design wise, or increase the range but make it so he cant attack when they get within 3-4 squares and make him an extreme long range but useless up front what does everyone else think?
I Think that we have the verge of two new units here. Thr sniper does need to lower its Health a lot. I say around 20 Health and no meele. Instead we add a shot that goes 4 spaces.
Mechanic Rifleman:
Though production, limited resources, and the complex design of Cera Bella firearms had confined gun-making to an art confined to small workshops, crossbows and psy being superior in every way, the first riflemen have completed their training and are now being tried in the field. The Mechanics have surely outdone themselves with their versatile gun.
Health: 22
PsP: 20 (if Craig decides to have AI's have limited PsP)
Speed: 3
Attacks:
Snipe--5 PsP, Str+0.5PA+3+1.5lvl Range 2
Snipe 2-- 7 PsP, Str+ 0.5PA+2+ 1lvl Range 4
Suppressive Fire--10 PsP, 0.75Str+3+0.8Lvl, Subtracts speed of rifleman by 2 for the next 2 turns, subtracts 3 speed off targets for two turns. Range 2-4
Resistance: Light
Immunity: None
Here what with the Blimp. I think that the blimp has a bit too much Health and it needs thave around 35. The blimp should also get rid of Carry as it can barely hold the minerals. The new bimp stats are:
Mechanic Blimp:
After a seris of tests and many failures, The Mechanics have created a blimp. This Blimp can fly because it is made from light materials and filled with a highly flammible air found in the deeper downs. These blimps carry minerals that have been compressed together in the Deeper Downs, what when are dropped create an explosion. These Blimp cannot carry more than one person and can burn extra gas in the blimp to move farther.
Health: 35
PsP: 20
Speed: 2 (Flying)
Attacks:
Bomb Bombardment: Cost 5 PsP, Range 3 (Backwards), Damage [Psy Power+2( Level X 2)]
Suicide Bomber: Cost 10 PsP, Range Omidirectional + Self, Damage [Psy Power+7+Level] (Note: When Move Is Done, Blimp is Destoryed)
Gas Burner: Cost 5 PsP, Range Self, Increases movement by 2
Resistance: None
I have the drawing of the sniper done. Sorry about the qualilty though, my paint failed me again.
Better sniper I think also like the added addition to suppression fire. For the blimp increase the speed say to 5 or 7 and lower the health to 30 and maybe have it so only ranged attacks can damage it or does extra damage.
Guns and Bombs don't fit in the Cera Bella world, so enemies that use guns or bombs should not be put in the game.
Okay so the sniper uses a bow or crossbow then what about .
name:ballista
health:20
range:whole map:
damage:10
drawback:can only be fired every other round
What do you guys think?
a ballista is a siege weapon... not really meant for the close quarter battles we experience... so my vote is "no, but thank you for the thought"
im2smart4u is right: bombs, guns and the lot don't fit in with the style of Telepath Universe at all.
The flying golem idea has been discussed before on the forums, but forget not that this is supposed to be a heavy support unit with its great disadvantage coming from limited mobility. There is also the issue of applying the right technologies, as our vision of a flying golem just didn't find a neat enough solution that would fit into the style of TSoG. Still, a flying enemy unit for the Helenites would be a great idea (from the looks of it, they should be technologically superior than the Mechanics and be using Dorgon-type models all the time)!
At the same time, going back to the ranged golem, I found another issue: although it is crdeible that the archers may carry a large number of arrows with them, where would a ranged golem find all the rocks to catapult at the enemy mid-battle? They would take up a lot of space and not many could be carried around. The issue of running out of ammo is usually not applicable to TRPG battles, but this can potentially be the first instance which cannot be adequately explained.
couldn't the boulder simply be psy controlled?
still they would take up space and it would be of the limited variety.
The problem with the boulder is not that it can't be psy controlled, but, rather, that the boulder has to come from somewhere, and I doubt a golem could teleport one onto the battlefield. And as they take up a lot of space, the golem will run out of boulders pretty fast.
Still, I do like the idea of a ranged golem, so I definitely welcome any suggestions which could circumvent the issue!
maybe using psy it takes chunks of dirt compresses it until it's as dense as rock and then using it's strength hurl them then as long as there's earth they have ammo?
An excavating golem? Neat solution, that! The only thing I can say is that it won't work over certain surfaces like bridges and chasms, or grass. But still: very neat solution!
PS
Here is what Zackrius has to say about his Glimp (published with his permission, of course):
"First of all, it is not a golem. It does not run by itself. It can be controlled by heating the air in the ballon, almost like how a hot air ballon flies. If that does not fit the Telepath style it can also be powered by psy crystals giving the power to float. Second, I wanted to say that the speed is up for depate. I personally like it having the option of gving itself more speed. But, its speed upgrade can only work once or twice giving the option of attacking with full force or striking first. I am willing to change its spped though. Third, about the bombs, they are not highly polished lead sealed bombs, but unstable fused rocks that come from the deeper mines. If this does not fit, the person in the blimp can chip away a small peice of the crystal controllig it and drop it down on the enemies. I am willing to take suggestions to make this unit more balanced (battle wise) and apporiate for the Telepath Seris."
My thoughts on this:
"Firstly, one has to consider the battleengine for the unit: this unit will be big, and the way it has to be designed is such that it can fit into one tile quite believably. Hence, a ballon might just not be enough to do so. A hovercraft of sorts, or a hang-glider (I like this option more) might do the trick. Next, the speed boost I think can be left out, but the speed can be made to be something like 3 (since most of Craig's AI is made for 3 speed and not above, and anything below 3 is a bit strange for a flying machine). Make it wooden and it can be light and possible to use: don't forget that the Mechanics rely on non-Psy methods to get their work done- even the high energy crystals only act as Psy-storage devices, but the mechanics are not generating them, they're simlpy manipulating them. I think instead of bombs, one can change this to a cross-bow, from above: it can deal 14 damage, like the Marksman, but have the advantage of flying over obstacles. I envisage the clothing of the hang-glider to be in the same colours as that of the marksman, possibly, like they print country flags on parachutes on occaison. Suicide bombing isn't really appropriate, and, methinks, coding of said unit can have it one attack only, and that would be sufficient, maybe add a counter-attack, like with the Marksman. This, methinks, fits the style of the Telepath world a bit better."
Also, new name for the unit: "Gliding Archer", again, suggested by Zackrius.
I like the excavating golem idea, and I also had my own. They could fire a boulder (or mace) with a chain on it. That way, you could pull it back.
The boulder that drags you back. I'm not a big fan of it. What happens if it draggs you over a chasm over water wouldn't you then die? No, I like the idea of the boulder being fired but not pulling you pack. I doupt their a scirpt to support that idea though. Nice idea though
Gliding Archer
After collecting the many lightweight sheets of thin cloth. The Helanites have created a glider. The sheets and been have been tightly bound and tied to a light wooden frame. The glider's passanger it connected to the frame via lightweight leather straps. This means that the archer can have his/her hand's free so he can shoot targets.
Health: 25
PsP: 20
Speed: 3
Attack:
Piercing Crosbow: (Range 2-3, Cost 4 Psp, Attack: 14)
Resistance: None
Immunity: Short Ranged Attacks(Range 1 Attacks) (It would make sense, as how can a sword hit something in the air) (Could make it a Resistance Though)
The unit would have a bird's eye view on it showing the top of the sails (The white part) with the arms, the head, and feat of the archer sticking out at the back sides andd front.
Um, how would a glider fly for the entire battle? Neat idea, though.
As for the boulder (or mace), the boulder/mace would have to be ridiculously huge to drag a golem into a river.
Quote from: yogc on March 05, 2010, 07:11:52 PM
Um, how would a glider fly for the entire battle? Neat idea, though.
As for the boulder (or mace), the boulder/mace would have to be ridiculously huge to drag a golem into a river.
If the wind is just right then a glider can relativity stay in the same spot, by swayying side to side
Ok, I like the Glinding Archer more now! The Crossbow can eb a standard attack, there is no need to add PsP cost, since it will be used by an enemy unit, and thus not take up PsP (and it's a physical attack, so that it doesn't need the Psy abilities of a person).
Also, I am not sure about the immunity- that would be too difficult to code, methinks. Plus, look how all the other flying units get no immunity- maybe have this glider slide along very close to the ground, such that it cannot easily pass over any other teammate (hence inability of any flying unit to move over a tile occupied by a teammate or an enemy). The person could be a cross-bow man with Light Resistance armor, though- they do have the technology to make one, which is pretty impressive.
The issue of wind is a big one, though- especially since it won't be there all the time, and how can the person control the glider? Solutions, ideas, anyone? (Not psy crystals- Helenites don't have Psys, as far as we know- remember how the Cultist threatened to use the Helenites instead? He wouldn't have done so if there were Psy folks amongst them.)
I don't like the throw-&-drag idea really, especially as it is, in a way, implemenetd in the Spin-Saw attack of the Bronze Golem, with the retractable blade. Still, creative ideas are good, keep them coming!
The fact that the throw and drag idea looks like a bronze golem is probably due to the fact that I based the throw and drag idea off of a bronze golem. To tell the truth, though, I think the excavating idea is pretty good.
The Improved Gliding Archer
Gliding Archer
After collecting the many lightweight sheets of thin cloth. The Helanites have created a glider. The sheets and been have been tightly bound and tied to a light wooden frame. The glider's passanger it connected to the frame via lightweight leather straps. This means that the archer can have his/her hand's free so he can shoot targets.
Health: 25
PsP: 0
Speed: 3
Attack:
Piercing Crosbow: (Range 2-3, Cost 0 Psp, Attack: 14)
Counter Attack: (Range 1-2, Attack: 10)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: None
Indeed, it is appealing, very creative, but there is the issue of certain surfaces which are not prone to excavation, and bridges are one prime example of that. (A shame, really, but it doesn't quite cover all the basis.)
Gliding Archer: Piercing Crossbow is good. Maybe it can be extra large simply due to the fact that some of the weight is supported by the gliders frame. How can in-air control can be explained though?
I think that the archer should be equiped with a psy crystal that creates levitation. Really its the only way it could stay up. If you have an idea though I am happy to here it.
Yeah, maybe the owners of the gliders (Helenites or Mechanics?) have access to the orb that creates levitation and were able to replicate the effects in small shards of crystals.
With The Excavation Golem. It could have a move of zero and the creator could put them only on squares that would support excavation. If the battle doesn't contain any pieces like that than it shouldn't be put it.
I think that this might induce unnecessary limitations with exacavation. How about a golem which fires a very thick, penetrating metal bolt? (Say, range 1-3?) I think that can be done and it won't be crossing the line over too mcuh, since it will be, in essence, a greater version of the crossbow. Thoughts, folks?
For the Glider enemy: how about using the simple idea of a cleverly-constructed wing that allows the human to do a short run-up when there is an obstacle ahead and use the wing to propel themselves over the obstcale such that when the unit is position over it and attacks, it's considered "mid flight", and when it's on the gorund, the unit has, essentially, landed (hence, when surrounded by enemies, he cannot fly over them). Also, with the way the system is crafted, the glide can stay a long time in the air, without the need for it to fall (I guess one would need a double wing system and something to generate local wind- like a small propeller operated by pedals).
Ok, so, with those additions, how about this for the Glider Archer:
Gliding Archer
Health: 25
Speed: 3
Attack: Piercing Crosbow (Range 2-3, Attack: 14)
Counter Attack: Crossbow (Range 2, Attack: 14)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: None
Thoughts, folks?
I was about to suggest something like the bolt myself. I like that idea.
Why does the Gliding Archer resist light?
Because its wearing "light" armour. Get it!. (I know that wasn't funny)
That's because there is a marksman strapped under it, and they have light-resistant armor (made specifically during the Shadow Wars by the Mechanics to protect the Marksmen from friendly fire originating from the Energy Golems).
Heh, light armor. :P
Okay...I guess that works...
About the golem, I don't know if it should be able to fire on a unit directly in front of it? What about you guys?
Well, I think friendly fire is inevitable in TRPG engine, though it can be toggled these days. I think it can: after all, why should the bolt change its trajectory- it's fired from close range, at high speed, I don't think there will be much curvature involved. Plus, it would remove a disadvantage of having this Golem easily cornered and destroyed, whilst it helplessly tries to run away.
Good point. These are the stats I have so far.
Cannon Golem (for lack of better name): Health: 33
Speed: 1
Attack: Bolt Shot (for lack of better name): Damage: 10 Range: 1-3
I Like Cannon Golem, its a good name. Now come up with some more facts about the Golem, and an intro to show how it has been created and works.
Let's see...
After years of competing against the Mechanics, Helena realized she needed a mobile, medium range, heavy hitter golem that would be cheaper and more armored than energy golems. Using various pieces of other golems, she created the cannon golem, capable of firing huge bolts and devastating enemies in its range.
Good Job! Now work on the attacks, costs, power, etc.
The Golems should be powerful enemies that are easy to avoid. With a speed of 1 and a range of 1, stone and bronze golems are slow powerhouses. Despite their unlimited range, energy golems are easy to avoid because of there speed is 0.
By increasing the Golems' range, the golems will be less easy to avoid and therefore they don't fit the golem niche.
Quote from: KZ on March 05, 2010, 07:43:07 PM
I think that this might induce unnecessary limitations with exacavation. How about a golem which fires a very thick, penetrating metal bolt? (Say, range 1-3?) I think that can be done and it won't be crossing the line over too mcuh, since it will be, in essence, a greater version of the crossbow. Thoughts, folks?
For the Glider enemy: how about using the simple idea of a cleverly-constructed wing that allows the human to do a short run-up when there is an obstacle ahead and use the wing to propel themselves over the obstcale such that when the unit is position over it and attacks, it's considered "mid flight", and when it's on the gorund, the unit has, essentially, landed (hence, when surrounded by enemies, he cannot fly over them). Also, with the way the system is crafted, the glide can stay a long time in the air, without the need for it to fall (I guess one would need a double wing system and something to generate local wind- like a small propeller operated by pedals).
Ok, so, with those additions, how about this for the Glider Archer:
Gliding Archer
Health: 25
Speed: 3
Attack: Piercing Crosbow (Range 2-3, Attack: 14)
Counter Attack: Crossbow (Range 2, Attack: 14)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: None
Thoughts, folks?
Remember people to say wiether or not you like this enemy and want him to be in the forumulated enemy list
QuoteBy increasing the Golems' range, the golems will be less easy to avoid and therefore they don't fit the golem niche.
The entire point of the cannon golem was to make a medium range, hard to defeat golem (sort of like Dorgon). If enough people think it shouldn't be mobile, though, I can change it.
Quote from: im2smart4u on March 05, 2010, 02:51:05 PM
Guns and Bombs don't fit in the Cera Bella world, so enemies that use guns or bombs should not be put in the game.
The Mechanics had a golem which fired gigantic laser beams.
I'm pretty sure ballistics are fine.
for the glider add an attack that has a range of 4 and get rid of the counter attack.
Quote from: Presentiment on March 05, 2010, 09:37:58 PM
Quote from: im2smart4u on March 05, 2010, 02:51:05 PM
Guns and Bombs don't fit in the Cera Bella world, so enemies that use guns or bombs should not be put in the game.
The Mechanics had a golem which fired gigantic laser beams.
I'm pretty sure ballistics are fine.
The energy golem uses crystals to fire lasers; not gun powder. Gunpowder doesn't fit in the Telepath world, so guns and bombs don't fit in the Telepath world.
Quote from: im2smart4u on March 06, 2010, 12:14:36 PM
Quote from: Presentiment on March 05, 2010, 09:37:58 PM
Quote from: im2smart4u on March 05, 2010, 02:51:05 PM
Guns and Bombs don't fit in the Cera Bella world, so enemies that use guns or bombs should not be put in the game.
The Mechanics had a golem which fired gigantic laser beams.
I'm pretty sure ballistics are fine.
The energy golem uses crystals to fire lasers; not gun powder. Gunpowder doesn't fit in the Telepath world, so guns and bombs don't fit in the Telepath world.
Of course they don't use gunpowder.
That wasn't my point.
My point was, what evidence do you have for your claim ballistics do not fit in the Telepath world?
Well, there isn't that much evidence, but in the real world, guns were invented long after other ballistics. For example, cannons were invented in somewhere around the 3rd century, along with gun powder (it wasn't called that). Guns came along in the 15th century. It would be one thing to have gun powder (or black powder, as the called it), but guns wouldn't quite be in the time zone.
I don't see your point. We haven't seen any fireworks in Telepath yet, but we have seen semi-intelligent golems and automatons who fire lasers.
In our world, steam engines, AI, and lasers (much less lasers powerful enough to pierce entire battlefields), came far after the invention of guns.
The lasers weren't created the same way lasers are today. Like im2smart4u said, they stored energy in crystals. The lasers are not a demonstration of technology in the TRPG universe, they are a demonstration of what you can do with a crystal.
As for the golems, I think the wiki said they were a species.
Plus, even if guns were invented, they would be in their early stages. In their early stages, they were about as good as a crossbow. There would be no point to having a gun that would do the same thing as a crossbow. Plus, it goes against the feel of the games.
Quote from: yogc on March 06, 2010, 04:02:25 PM
Plus, even if guns were invented, they would be in their early stages. In their early stages, they were about as good as a crossbow. There would be no point to having a gun that would do the same thing as a crossbow. Plus, it goes against the feel of the games.
If you were armed with one of the first guns, you had one inaccurate shot and then you had no time to reload. Now you have to use the gun as a club.
Some cultures develop some concepts faster then others. The Mayans had a highly advance understanding of astronomy, yet they never invented the wheel.
Plus, the majority of people agree that guns and bombs don't fit in the Telepath world.
Gliding Archer
Health: 25
Speed: 3
Attack: Piercing Crosbow (Range 2-3, Attack: 14)
Counter Attack: Crossbow (Range 2, Attack: 14)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: None
Cannon Golem: Health: 33
Speed: 1
Attack: Bolt Shot (for lack of better name): Damage: 10 Range: 1-3
As far as I can see, these are the only two ideas that have been presented for about two pages. I think it would be best if we started presenting ideas again. If you want to discuss gunpowder, I suggest you discuss it on the "Technology of Cera Bella" thread.
what about some type of watchtower health would be like 40 speed is 0 or something cant think of any attacks right now.
Instead of having a watch tower as an enemy, you could have it as a small building (1x1 square) and have a marksman or some other ranged unit inside.
I like the gliding archer idea.
Could he be propelled by the same source of energy that the golems use?
About the canon golem, I don't really like it that much... I think that the dirt throwing golem is a better idea. Could it only appear in places whithout water or bridges?
Another way to go was to make a version 2.0 of the existing golems. Like an iron golem with a spin saw attack of range 2 from both sides, like:
-G-: Golem
L: Places attacked with the left arm
R: Places attacked with the right arm
The dirt throwing golem was a good idea, but it wouldn't make sense to scoop dirt up from a wooden bridge.
I think the iron golem might have a few friendly fire problems...
All the ranged attack have a few friendly fire problems.
Before, what I meant to say is that the dirt throwing golem could appear only in maps without bridges.
yeah that was my idea when I posted it have it only places with dirt and sand which there is a lot of desert.
Another idea is to have a static dirt throwing golem that can shoot in the diagonal too. Perhaps a range 2 attack at North and a 1 diagonal attack at NE or NW.
Anyway, in my opinion, a static golem is not as fun to fight against as a moving one.
Going back to the Arhcer Glider: I like the idea and I support it. Two pages back, I believe, I gave a hand-waving explanation of how it can be used without the need to resort to Crystals or the likes.
For the issue of ballistsics, like all the others said: that simply doesn't fit into the Telepath world, Craig also commented on the aspects on the old forums. Hence the majority is against gun-powder and the likes, . as was the case on the old forums as well.
For the Golem, I prefer best the Bolt Golem version: a ranged golem that fires bolts at people. (So, made from metal itself, it will have some of the bolts stored inside it- I'm pretty sure it will be credible enough, since it won't use more than 10 per battle, typically. And then the bolts can be re-stocked later on- same goes for arrows and the likes.)
With the excavating golem- there is the terrain type issue, which I don't think will be overcome, thus I think the above might be the best we can come up with in terms of rendering a credible, projectile-throwing golem.
what about a golem like the laser ones but instead it shoots a condensed ball of pure psy which explodes once it touches something.
health:35
attack:psy bomb or explosion damage 15 range 3 3x3;
counter attack: damage 5 range1
speed:2
resistance:physical
weakness:none
For the archer golem I suggest the name Arbalest Golem (arbalest: noun :a powerful medieval crossbow with a steel bow, used to shoot stones, metal balls, arrows, etc.) It seems to fit with the current and probable future descriptions of this golem and it would be nice to have a more set name than floating it around with Cannon Golem, Archer Golem, and much better that "Piercing-Steel-Rod-Launching Golem" :P
Name sounds cool, but no one playing the games would have any clue what arbalest means.
I see no problem with Arbalest. The same way most of the players will not know that Tig came from sterigma (a horn shaped structure from which the spores are released).
Good point. Should we call it the Arbalest Golem or just the Arbalest?
Seems like all folks are content with the Gliding Archer idea, so I'll go ahead and add that into formulated.
For the golem, I like the Arbalest name- those who know Russian will get the meaning of it straight away. Plus, Craig puts in lots of cultural references,so those who wish to, may explore and learn something knew (I mean, c'mon, Hobbes, Locke as Spriggat Assassins?! Penumbra? I am sure someone somewhere wondered... and found out something interesting because of it!)
I am against excavation type golem, due to terrain limitation, but a huge cross-bow with firing an arrow, rather than a bolt, seems fitting, in my opinion.
Quote from: KZ on March 14, 2010, 06:22:04 PM
Seems like all folks are content with the Gliding Archer idea, so I'll go ahead and add that into formulated.
The only problem I find with the Gliding Archer is the movement of a glider. How can a glider float in one place and how does a glider make 90 degree turns?
as KZ stated, the glider only "flies" when going over flyable terain, other wise he is one the ground. in order to glide he/she either uses telekinesis to give him/her-self lift or uses some other sort of telepathy to "run-up" the object.
I did post an elaborate explanations a few pages back, if you don't mind sifting through it, then I think it's on page 6 or 7.
Zhampir almost got it right: the explanation involves using a very elaborate wing design to make sharp turns without resorting to Psy abilities (double wing model, with very complex aerodynamics- might be hard to draw). The floating in one place, if over an obstacle, can be explained by the glider being forzen mid-flight during that one turn (effectively it's rather hard to apply real-time onto the battlefield turn system)- so let' jsut say that the person runs up in such a fashion as to fly over an obstacle and execute a complex turn.
Quote from: Zhampir on March 14, 2010, 06:56:34 PM
as KZ stated, the glider only "flies" when going over flyable terain, other wise he is one the ground. in order to glide he/she either uses telekinesis to give him/her-self lift or uses some other sort of telepathy to "run-up" the object.
The Guard memebers are not allowed to be psys, so telepathy is not an option.
Just to point out: the Glider is part of the Mechanics ensemble, not the Ravinale Guard.
I think the glider is a unit of the mechanics not the cult. besides, as KZ pointed out, my memory of the dynamics of the glider were off. Instead the mobility of the unit seems to be entirely mechanically based without any (or little) psy influence.
Wouldn't a regular Crossbow be better then Piercing Crosbow? The physic involved wouldn't allow a large enough crosbow to pierce through a person and hit the person behind. The wieght of such a crossbow would be much greater then the lift of the wings and the force of firing a massive crossbow would create thrust in the wrong direction. Since the Glider is busy piloting the glider, wouldn't it be more difficult for him to counter-attack then a regular crossbowman?
Quote from: im2smart4u on February 14, 2010, 07:17:47 PM
You don't need a knife to be an Assassin. Some humans use their speed and stealth alongside their psy powers to dispatch enemy units. (you can play human psy assassin in the Dual mode of TPRG2)
Psy Assassin
Health: 50
Speed: 4
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 10), Feedback (Range: 2, Healing/Damage: 15)
Does anyone think that the human Psy Assassin shouldn't be Formulated (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=27.0)?
I don't see any reason why he should have a piercing attack or a counter... after all, he'd have to reload his crossbow so it doesn't seem logical that he could quickly counter...
I think you should go ahead and formulate the Psy Assassin idea. Once we all agree on what the golem should fire and what its stats should be, we could probably formulate that too.
I agree that the Psy Assassin can be formulated- there is little discussion on that at the moment, or ever.
I do woner though why you good folks haven't voiced your issues with the glider before it became formulated? 'Cause I saw three pages of same arguments that didn't highlight any of this stuff. Do you still feel the need for improvement? On, say, the counterattack point, I do agree: hence I wonder if the stats proposed were the best ones. So, if you feel it needs a re-think, kindly post your thoughts here.
I think I was content with the flying archer (glider) when I saw it. I was more focused on the golem. I do like the idea of a piercing crossbow. Since the glider is flying, the extra speed boost might allow him to fire a quick moving crossbow bolt that pierces the target.
I don't think it should be able to go through 3 targets. That would be one fast arrow to cleanly go through one target, and still hit 2 more targets doing the same damage.
On that note I think the 2 placed target should receive less damage.
The piercing crossbow only goes through two targets. Maybe the second target should receive less damage, though.
I think that the less damage part might be too difficult to code in. Plus, if it is thrust with enough force, the impact parameters should be roughly equal.
Arbalest Golem: Health: 33
Speed: 1
Attack: Bolt Shot (for lack of better name): Damage: 10 Range: 1-3
These are the stats for the golem. Does anyone think there needs to be any changes?
The only arrow that can go through a person and hit the person behind would be from a ballista. I just don't see a ballista and a person being caried by a small glider.
If th spearhead was shaped in a trinagliar fashion almost like the bannet on a mussket it could with engough force rip through something soft like an arm or leg
A crossbow is very powerful by itself. With the extra energy from the glider's motion, the bolt could penetrate more than one person.
Quote from: yogc on March 15, 2010, 03:29:38 PM
A crossbow is very powerful by itself. With the extra energy from the glider's motion, the bolt could penetrate more than one person.
With a speed of three, I think the glider is closer to hovering then zooming through the air.
Quote from: yogc on March 15, 2010, 03:04:42 PM
Arbalest Golem: Health: 33
Speed: 1
Attack: Bolt Shot (for lack of better name): Damage: 10 Range: 1-3
These are the stats for the golem. Does anyone think there needs to be any changes?
The range is insanely far. Make the range, 1-2 or just 2. A moving golem shouldn't be able to hit you, while you can't hit it.
Coupled with the triagliar shape and the soften of human flesh it could go thow more than one person
Quote from: Zackirus on March 15, 2010, 03:39:34 PM
Coupled with the triagliar shape and the soften of human flesh it could go thow more than one person
I may be mistaken, but most soldiers have armor on.
Is that your way of saying, im2msart4u, that you'd like further discussion on the Glider?
W.r.t. the Golem idea, I am sure that internal mechanics may be constructed in such a way as to make the forward acceleration of the bolt/arrow very fast, such that it will easily penetrate several people at once. Energy Golems will hit anything on the battlefield- very few units can get away from them. Hence, I don't really see as "I can hit it, but it can't hit back" as a requirement for a unit to be a golem. On the other hand, I don't mind whether the range is 1-2 or 1-3: as long as it's a ranged golem, the idea remains intact.
The triangular arrow heads were armor piercing. They could go through armor from a longbow without too much difficulty, and a crossbow is more powerful.
Ok, a completely new enemy here, arising from the Juxtapose thread (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=202.0). Why not have a boss, which is an exceptionally powerful spirit which can combine soul suck and juxtapose into one, such that it will be able to inhabit a body of a teammate when the said teammate is within few points of death (say, below 5)? This will force the player to kill a teammate in a worst-case scenario. The AI for the teammate inhabited body would be to simply use most basic attacks, or search for area attacks. The player will lose if the boss inhabits the Hero, naturally. Thoughts?
I think there is already a ghost boss proposed, maybe it could have that attack.
That would certainly be quite a twist, absolutely evil. I like it :-*
but would the ghost inhabited teammate retain its former hp or have it's old hp? and would the body that the ghost had then be controlled by the ally?
yogc: I honestly don't remember any ghost boss propositions in main threads for the last one-and-a-half years!
Zhampir: that would be the trick, to get the ghost's hp (otherwise it will be easily killed on the next turn), and the ghost's old body will be in the teammates body, so instead of two units there will be just one.
hmm... I wonder how we could program the AI to know when exactly it would be a good idea to perform such a trick... or perhaps the skill could be transferred to the new host?
The easiest solution would be to use the same attacks the spirit knows (after all, why should the body retain knowledge of skills learned by the previous soul?), so the whole concept is simplified. It also makes the boss very difficult to kill indeed. How about this be a crypt 4 boss? Name: Greatest Ghost. Seems pretty fitting to me. In addendum to all the standard Greater Ghost attacks it could also have the 4th attack, which allows him to invade the body (something along the lines of "Soul Expulsion"?). The only thing retain from the original host will be the body, but repaired and replensihed to full hp by the spirit.
How about in the 4th crypt we find a lone blue-caped psy named Z with his partner in crime, the famous kleptomaniac zebra, KZ?
Z is a fast moving psy assassin that runs headlong into a batch of enemies hitting them hard with cryo cross (one of the very few moves he has because he's too hardheaded to use anything else) while KZ stops all the other enemies using his powerful telepathic persuasion to eliminate hostilities (i.e. he paralyzes them)
Also including a character named Laurie that "paints" images of teammates on the screen distracting enemies?
Now where did that jsut come from O-o! :P
Speaking of comcic reliefs, this is as random as it gets!
And why not? :P Maybe Craig will have a taste for some tension relief in mission 4!
Anyhow, methinks the greatest ghost idea is not too unoriginal to ponder about.
Quote from: KZ on March 15, 2010, 03:56:27 PM
Is that your way of saying, im2msart4u, that you'd like further discussion on the Glider?
Isn't that obvious. I think the counter-attack should be removed, because the pioleting the glider would make it too difficult to counter-attack.
I think the attack should be changed to a regular Crossbow, because the glider would be unable to fly with a ballista. Only a ballista would be able to use an attack like Piercing Crosbow.
Improved Gliding ArcherHealth: 25
Speed: 3
Attack: Crossbow (Range 2, Attack: 14)
Resistance: Light
Obvious it may be, but I did ask specifically to differentiate between simple rants and an actial desire to reconsider the submitted idea. That could've easily been classifies as a little rant. Hence the question.
Your logic is sound and I do agree with what you say. What do the rest of you folks think? If you all agree, then I shall make amends to the unit in formulated ideas. I think the fact that it is a flying unit is already good enough, so having a piercing crossbow may not be a must-have.
It is possible for a crossbow to go through somebody if fired at point blank range, plus the triangular shape of a head of the bolt add to the penetration of the bolt. It is also possible for a crossow to hold more than one bolt at a time.
Zackirus, unless I am much mistaken, this is the 4th time you're rephrasing what you've said before?
I think what you're saying is possible, but given that the glider will be hitting targets from above, it can hardly be considerd as point-blank range. But then again, it all depends on the strength of the launching mechniasm used. If the Mechanics are ingenious enough, maybe they can make their weapon powerful enough to penetrate through two enemies,not one.
Somewhere on page three, a ghost boss called a Zeitgiset was suggested. Just an alternative name instead of Greatest Ghost.
Quote from: KZ on March 15, 2010, 08:35:41 PM
Zackirus, unless I am much mistaken, this is the 4th time you're rephrasing what you've said before?
Wow the fourth Time, I never knew. I just want for people to see that my idea is Feasible
Well Zackirus, if it makes you happy, I think your idea is feasible (and yes, I am being sincere). I would go on and explain why your idea is feasible, but I imagine KZ wouldn't be too happy. I do think the counter attack should be removed, though.
Fair enough: it has already been formalized though, so it's just minor tweaking here and there for the majority of the populace to be satiated with.
Mmm, yogc, what's with me not being happy about? I mean, as long as you put it into thread context, that's fine by me!
I take it most are against the conuter-attack, and some may have issues with the range of the unit? Can all who have an opinion please list changes and suggestions quickly below, so that we geta compilation and a quick decision on what to amend!
Personally, I'd remove the counter-attack, and I am pretty much neutral on the range issue.
In Zackirus's defense, his idea was objected repeatedly by the same person with the same reasoning each time. If Zackirus did not reply in nearly the same manner each time then it would seem to someone that did not go back through the topic that the opposer was correct, when in fact, he had been proven wrong.
The range is fine at 1-2
I'm fine with everything but the counter attack.
Just to calarify: in keeping the range 1-2, or 1-3, the assumption is that piercing shot is used, rather than the standrad crossbow. So do you support the piercing shot idea then, Zhampir?
How About This, New Preposed Stats:
Gilding Archer
Health: 25
Speed: 3
PsP: 0
Attacks: Piercing Shot (Range 1-2, Cost 0, Attack 14) Crowsbow 2 (Range 3, Cost 0, Attack 14)
I support the piercing shot, Zack has relentlessly defended the idea.
Quote from: Zhampir on March 15, 2010, 09:30:21 PM
In Zackirus's defense, his idea was objected repeatedly by the same person with the same reasoning each time. If Zackirus did not reply in nearly the same manner each time then it would seem to someone that did not go back through the topic that the opposer was correct, when in fact, he had been proven wrong.
I keep find new reasons why Piercing Crossbow will not work, while Zackirus repeatively says "it will work".
You have to choose a light wieght crossbow that can be held by a glider or a heavy ballista that is stuck on the ground?
A light weight crossbow can pierce a target that is close enough. You keep on saying you need a ballista to penetrate a target. A ballista could easily penetrate a target 3 squares away. The crossbow is only penetrating something directly in front of it. It is very doable.
Ballistas are made to go through armored walls of a castle not through light weight armor. Piercing arrows designed as Zackirus described could easily have that effect. A light weight crossbow could utilizing barbs as such could go through two enemies as well. The continued discussion of how these arrows could not work is pointless. They can, they are logical, and it should be formulated. A ballista was never meant for taking out soldiers, they are too slow to maneuver and soldiers could easily move out of the way.
Read this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodkin_point) article.
You can't shoot an arrow through two people.
If you want to keep it perhaps explain the glider has some resonance crystals and the pilot is a Psy? That way, piercing and counterattack can be explained.
How about using not just an arrow, but a reinforced bolt? A tad heavier, modified, etc, but that would pierce through more than one person, taking ballistics and a little belief into Mechanics being able to come up with a powerful and light launching mechanism.
Also, keeping this unit Psy-less, so that it can fit in with the mechanics, is everyone then against the counter-attacking part, at least?
Quote from: Presentiment on March 15, 2010, 09:53:54 PM
You can't shoot an arrow through two people.
Its not an arrow remember, it is a bolt, a bolt is smaller and it can trave faster and pack more of a punch
You remember this thing needs to fly, right?
The contraption for shooting such a weapon will be similar to a ballista. It will be shot from the air, forcing the contraption to be stronger as the craft needs to keep stable.
Because too much of a weight at the front will cause it to nosedive, the weight will need to be evenly distributed along the craft.
Then it needs to be able to lift off, presumably without powerful engines. It will be in the air, which is a thousandth the density of water.
It's a glider, it needs to hold itself up. It will be huge.
And even assuming you can do all that, you need to be able to hover and accelerate/deaccelerate at will.
And even then, if you somehow manage to do a feat which even now we can't do with much control, you have to be accurate, and the cost can't be too prohibitive.
All in our universe's physics, of course, but I don't see any evidence pointing to the contrary in Cera Bella.
So why not just use a Psy and save the world with deus ex machina?
Quote from: Zackirus on March 15, 2010, 10:02:18 PM
Quote from: Presentiment on March 15, 2010, 09:53:54 PM
You can't shoot an arrow through two people.
Its not an arrow remember, it is a bolt, a bolt is smaller and it can trave faster and pack more of a punch
What cow poop you spew out.
Please try to be a tad bit more respectful.
I do agree that the enemy should be a psy, though.
A bolt is a big arrow.
...
If they were lighter and more effective arrows would never be used.
That is much more informative than what you said previously. Assuming the glider pilot is a psy, would you be for or against the idea?
Why. The. HellInferno. Is. Everyone. On. This. Forum. So. Patronizing.
I think it would be a good idea if the pilot was a psy, seeing as telekinesis explains everything in the Telepath Universe.
You really don't want to see just how not patronizing I can be.
This brings up a question: do the mechanics have psys in their ranks?
To hell Inferno with the Mechanics. Who says it's a Mechanic creation? And even so, the Mechanics used resonance crystals in golems.
Quote from: yogc on March 15, 2010, 09:50:04 PM
A light weight crossbow can pierce a target that is close enough. You keep on saying you need a ballista to penetrate a target. A ballista could easily penetrate a target 3 squares away. The crossbow is only penetrating something directly in front of it. It is very doable.
So it could go through a person at
very close range.
That means the stats are: Piercing Shot (Range 0.5-1, Attack 14)
Quote from: yogc on March 15, 2010, 10:17:45 PM
This brings up a question: do the mechanics have psys in their ranks?
I don't think psys would want to join the Mechanics. There are probably better opportunities for psys then an organization that focuses on Golems instead of Psy Soldiers.
Modern tests with an armor-piercing bodkin arrow could not pierce plate armor at point blank range.
Quote from: Presentiment on March 15, 2010, 10:33:08 PM
Modern tests with an armor-piercing bodkin arrow could not pierce plate armor at point blank range.
But the crossbow fires smaller, less powerful bolts. (Yes, I am making fun of the bolt argument)
Quote from: Presentiment on March 15, 2010, 10:33:08 PM
Modern tests with an armor-piercing bodkin arrow could not pierce plate armor at point blank range.
Most of the main characters are not wearing armour, a crowsbow bolt can go threw flesh and come out the other side
Where does this "less powerful" come in to play? Bolts are much stronger than arrows fired from a longbow. Lightweight materials can be nearly just as effective as more heavy materials. Keep in mind this needs nowhere near the amount of strength that your idea of a ballista needs. Much more like a scorpio (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scorpio_%28Dart-thrower%29). Also the projectile is given a further boost of speed because of the speed of the launching devise. The vectors are added.
Thus the idea of a piercing bolt is feasible. as Zackirus points out the only people that have armor are the Cultist guards and the Mechanics, since the unit will be a Mechanic the issue of armor will likely not arise. Please limit the amount of rude comments. They are rather distasteful and only serve to ruin your argument.
Even if the target was naked, the arrow can go through them and someone behind them?
Well, for that matter, could a spear go through two people without some help? No. An arrow could go through people with some help from a psy.
And that point is irrelevant because Zhampir is trying to defend the feasibility of an archer without psy.
Well, I personally think the archer should be a psy. It makes a lot more sense. It would be harder without a psy.
Which is what I've been saying too...
for the whole time.
Is this proof enough you don't read carefully?
or not at all?
Quote from: KZ on March 15, 2010, 04:56:20 PM
Ok, a completely new enemy here, arising from the Juxtapose thread (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=202.0). Why not have a boss, which is an exceptionally powerful spirit which can combine soul suck and juxtapose into one, such that it will be able to inhabit a body of a teammate when the said teammate is within few points of death (say, below 5)? This will force the player to kill a teammate in a worst-case scenario. The AI for the teammate inhabited body would be to simply use most basic attacks, or search for area attacks. The player will lose if the boss inhabits the Hero, naturally. Thoughts?
Quote from: yogc on March 15, 2010, 04:57:32 PM
I think there is already a ghost boss proposed, maybe it could have that attack.
Wow, it took some digging to find this one, and I thought I should bring it up again before it's forgotten, again.
original:
Quote from: torugo on February 22, 2010, 07:34:18 PM
first i recommend a boss like this because the other crypts went by to fast and we at least need some kind of good fight in the end
second this is not my game so i cant add that stuff in that is for the original creator to do im just trying to come up with ideas
I came up with a well-liked named, the Zeitgeist, meaning the spirit of the time/age or one "pardon moi francious mais" bad-ass spirit.
So, it's torugo's design for a spirit boss, with the the added attack of a juxtapose/soul-suck combination (needs a name, and I'm pulling a blank other than simply Transference, but it's not catchy enough, and I have further reasoning why it shouldn't be other names here (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=202.0)) proposed by KZ, named by me. oh, and the design might reflect a ghostly tastidan (Tastidan with blue/white coloring)
the stats suggested by (Frosty are (includes KZ's attack, which was suggested by me when I read KZ's explanation of Juxtapose)):
That's a start, but now we need stats. I think it should be close to this:
Zeitgest
Health: 75
Speed: 4
Attacks:
| | Mind Blast
Cryo Blast
Cryo Cross
Transference | Damage:
| 15
23
21
5 [kills previous body's owner and transfers the boss's spirit (including psy hp and psy psp) along with this attack into the new target] |
Resistance: Cold
Immunity: Physical
Counter: Mind Blast
I like everything but the the figure, I don't like having it a Tastidan, instead why don't you makeit like a great ghoster but have the cape drop overthe arms and maybe take out the rips in the cape.
Quote from: yogc on March 15, 2010, 11:54:26 PM
Well, for that matter, could a spear go through two people without some help? No. An arrow could go through people with some help from a psy.
The spearman will be a psy so that is why Piercing Throw will work. The mechanics don't have psys, so the arrow will not be aided by telekinesis, therefore it will be unable to go through a person and hit a second person.
Should we have a vote count on who wants to see a piercing shot, and who wants to see just the standard crossbow? I think yes, so here (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=219.0) is the topic where I suggest we settle this in a statistical way- by way of majority and good logic to back up your arguments, folks!
Meanwhile, let's see what othere enemies we have here?
Going back to the Greatest Ghost idea (I really don't like the zeitgest name, it also doesn't fit in at all with enemy names of TRPG), I think that the ghost, after using his 4th attack, should retain his Psy attacks- after all, it's well aware of how to use them, and it's Psy in nature (and I'd assume the Gift is connected to the Soul/Spirit, not the body), thereby eliminating a big AI problem of encoding the ghost to wisely select the attacks the host body used to perform.
one more enemy for the bug class
shadow moth
health 30
speed 2
atack: poisen miasma
I don't think that's necessary: the bug set, if the Void Bug gets included, will be pretty much complete. Besides, this moth does exactly the same job as the Shadow Bug, so why add it?
supposedly this moth is flying?
Yes, but I just don't see a flying Shadow Bug: they're too big and not really Psy cretaures (or, at least, very weakly Psy).
Going back to the Greatest Ghost idea, just to add in some stats: let's use the same ones from the Greater Ghost, but increase hp to, say, 90 and add in "Inhabit" (or whatever other name comes to mind, for the Ghost to remove someone's soul from the body and insert itself into it). Resistance, Immunity, Speed: all same as for the Greater Ghost. This way, the amount of changes to the AI will get reduced.
Any more ideas that spring to mind, folks?
Quote from: KZ on March 16, 2010, 06:26:38 PMGoing back to the Greatest Ghost idea (I really don't like the zeitgest name, it also doesn't fit in at all with enemy names of TRPG)
Greatest Ghost is kinda corny. Why not just call it "Phantom", "Wraith", or "Poltergeist"? My favorite is "Wraith".
Quote from: KZ on March 17, 2010, 03:49:04 PM
Yes, but I just don't see a flying Shadow Bug: they're too big and not really Psy cretaures (or, at least, very weakly Psy).
I completly agree with that. Plus shadow moth's attack doesn't even have damage or range.
I'll go along with "Wraith" as well, after all, it's a boss type enemy. And yes, the Greatest Ghost does sound a bit corny.
I've looked up the stats for the Greater Ghost, and amended the slightly to get the following:
"Wraith"
Health: 90
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 16), Cryo Blast (Range: 2, Damage: 19), Cryo Cross (Range: 1-2 Omnidirectional (Diamond shape), Damage: 13), Inhabit (Range: 1; Damage: none*)
Immunity: Physical
Resistance: Cold
*Inhabit can only work if the target's hp is equal to, or less than 5, works by the Wraith taking the host body, extracting the host soul, then restoring the new body to full hp.
Keeps the same attacks as before, since the attacks known are not bound to the body, but to the experience of the spirit/soul which inhabits it. Given that the Wraith used to be human, all the Psy attacks do not rely in some way or other on the owners body, so can be used with a body of any species (e.g. Spriggats are limited to their bodies for their elemental attacks, the Shadowport is also limited to Shadowlings body, etc).
Any thoughts on this?
Also, which other enemy set do you feel is not complete and needs additions?
What do you think of the Helenite unit set? Any suggestions? (There are a few golem ideas that were proposed for the Helenites, including using Dorgon-type golems, rather than Energy Golems, 'cause Helena had access to Dorgon.)
hmm how about a spike sphere? Extremely low health, high mobility and high damage. One attack, stab, produces a spike that stabs the enemy in front. I'm just trying to think of a radical design to go with the mechanical characteristics of the golems.
To be honest, I think the golem theme has been very thoroughly canvassed and we might as well move on and look for fresh ideas elsewhere.
Blurp- A large toad that are found in the bogs and forests of Cera Bella. It can leap great distances to catch its prey. Known to cause massive damage, the monster's tongue can be launched at great speeds at a target.
Health: 35
Speed: 2; Leap
Attacks: Tongue Strike (Range: 2, Damage: 8 )
Quote from: im2smart4u on March 17, 2010, 10:45:16 PM
Blurp- A large toad that are found in the bogs and forests of Cera Bella. It can leap great distances to catch its prey. Known to cause massive damage, the monster's tongue can be launched at great speeds at a target.
Health: 35
Speed: 2; Leap
Attacks: Tongue Strike (Range: 2, Damage: 8)
You have to be careful about the parenthesis. 8)
More damage please?
The Toad idea I like, but I`m confused about one thing do you actually want it to be able to hope over your teammates or is it going to have the attack Leap, As for damage I think is should be around 12 attack thus having a greater effect on your team.
I have also created A new idea, hat about an enemy that was mounted. No I do not mean they are on horses, but a simple creature that have domesticated and they could Ride On. It would have to move quite quickly a creature because of this units speed.
Mounted Guardsmen
The Guardsmen of Rubat (or any or place) have been training *blank* so that they could ride on. After many generation of breeding and interaction between Humans, these *blank* are now let's humans mount and ride them.
Health: 30
Speed: 4
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (Range 1, Cost 0, Attack 14) Counter Attack (Range 1, Cost 0, Attack 14)
Immunity: None
Resistance: None
I think that for the Mount it would have to be some sort of four-legged creature that would have hooves. I was thinking a creature that would be a crossbreed between a camel and horse, having that body of a horse, with a thin coat like the camels and would show behaviours like a camel, but being slightly more aggressive when found in the wild. I also think that this animal should be both wild (found in the desert) and be found in Rubat. A name I was thinking of for this animal would be a Glare.
Glare
Health: 20
Speed: 4
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (Range 1, Cost 0, Attack: 10)
Immunity: None
Resistance: None
Blurp, you say? Ha, I think that unit could be introduced just for the sake of comic relief! Or why not have it as a pet?
Leap: methinks it's similar to the idea of the Assassin and Shadowling Assassin, where a unit can jump over a teammate and backstab. I think that having at least one such an enemy with good AI will noticeably enhance the battle experience.
For the mounted enemy unit: just make sure that the animal design fits in reasonably well into a square tile (that's the general trouble with horses and camels).
Quote from: KZ on March 18, 2010, 01:43:01 PM
Blurp, you say? Ha, I think that unit could be introduced just for the sake of comic relief! Or why not have it as a pet?
You know, the Gelves could have them as pets........
Quote from: KZ on March 18, 2010, 01:43:01 PM
For the mounted enemy unit: just make sure that the animal design fits in reasonably well into a square tile (that's the general trouble with horses and camels).
If Nelis(who I assume is quite big), Bronze Golems, and Dark Spriggats can all fit into one square each, then I don't see the problem with the Glares. They also could be relatively small (there are some small horses breeds can be rode)
That thought also crossed my mind. But the pets for that particular Gelf have already been dtermined. Still, the creature might inhabit some swamp in the Great Forest, perhaps?
I misundestand: I meant that a creature like a horse is very long and narrow, so the proportions don't really fit well into a square tile, it will have to take up two tiles. Hence, it's best to think through of what the animal would look like, so it's proportions would be roughly srquare overall (look at the Shadow Bug, for instance).
Quote from: KZ on March 18, 2010, 01:43:01 PM
Blurp, you say? Ha, I think that unit could be introduced just for the sake of comic relief! Or why not have it as a pet?
Leap: methinks it's similar to the idea of the Assassin and Shadowling Assassin, where a unit can jump over a teammate and backstab. I think that having at least one such an enemy with good AI will noticeably enhance the battle experience.
Like the "Tig", I thought the "Blurp" could be named by the Folk-of-the-Woods.
Quote from: Zackirus on March 18, 2010, 01:50:01 PMGelves
I think it is "Gelfs" as many people with the name Gelf or it is "Wood-Folk" as members of the green-skinned race.
Good thought, im2msart4u. Maybe there will be a Blurp out there, but not for the particalar Gelf who might join as teammate. But how about enciuntering wild Blurps?
I would go or the Wild blurps, but I would also like to see a Gelf wth one too!
Then How about for the Glare, it is a sort of Sand Spider. It is as highly smooth and polished hooves (like that of a horse) but it is more square based, sort of like the shadow bug but these bugs are different in nature. They do not work together or have a queen; they simply act as lone predators, sort of like The great white shark. They only way you could get these animals to attack you would be to find one in the desert and you provoke it or it has been order to attack you by its owner.
The Bug can move so quickly over terrain is its weight is distributed evenly throughout its body, and it is very light, only 80 pounds. However a lot of that weight is muscle in its legs and back, so it can carry people and still move fast.
seems a reasonable solution to the mounted unit problem.
I liked both the blurp and the wraith idea. (Although I have the feeling that the wraith might cause a couple of bugs.)
I agree that the Wraith might cause a few bugs, but I think it will be well worth it: another challenge to the player, in order to slay the unit and keep all teammates alive, watch over teammate health and not let it drop too low!
Just a reminder of what the unit is:
"Wraith"
Health: 90
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 16), Cryo Blast (Range: 2, Damage: 19), Cryo Cross (Range: 1-2 Omnidirectional (Diamond shape), Damage: 13), Inhabit (Range: 1; Damage: none*)
Immunity: Physical
Resistance: Cold
*Inhabit can only work if the target's hp is equal to, or less than 5, works by the Wraith taking the host body, extracting the host soul, then restoring the new body to full hp.
Anyone got any more suggestions, please do voice, as, methinks, it is tempting to soon make this idea formulated.
Same goes for Blurp:
"Blurp- A large toad.
Health: 35
Speed: 2; Leap
Attacks: Tongue Strike (Range: 2, Damage: 8 )"
Thoughts, ideas, like/dislike?
Quote from: KZ on March 21, 2010, 11:53:35 AM
"Wraith"
Health: 90
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 16), Cryo Blast (Range: 2, Damage: 19), Cryo Cross (Range: 1-2 Omnidirectional (Diamond shape), Damage: 13), Inhabit (Range: 1; Damage: none*)
Immunity: Physical
Resistance: Cold
*Inhabit can only work if the target's hp is equal to, or less than 5, works by the Wraith taking the host body, extracting the host soul, then restoring the new body to full hp.
I like the Wraith, but it just seems too close to the Greater Ghost.
Quote from: KZ on March 21, 2010, 11:53:35 AM
Same goes for Blurp:
"Blurp- A large toad.
Health: 35
Speed: 2; Leap
Attacks: Tongue Strike (Range: 2, Damage: 8 )"
"A large toad"? What happened to my description?
I was just quoting the crucial statistics, exclduing description. (For full description of both the units see the previous page, folks!)
What would you suggest changing for the "Wraith" to make it more different? I mean, the 4th attack seems to make all the difference, and it is, really, just an exceptionally powerful Greater Ghost.
<6 HP is too little.
Indeed, I was also thinking that this might not occur too infrequently in the game, but then having the condition be <11hp, for instance, would that not be too difficult for the player in-battle? Though, to be fair, if this is a big boss, even for a side mission, then it will probably occur much later on in the game, when teammates have much higher hp. In fact, I'll start a poll right here (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=251.0) for suggestions on what the limit hp is best.
Back on Topic ( I have explained what these are and how they work, and even made a forum):
Mounted Guardsmen
The Guardsmen of Rubat (or any or place) have been training Glares so that they could ride on. After many generation of breeding and interaction between Humans, these Glares are now let's humans mount and ride them.
Health: 30
Speed: 4
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (Range 1, Cost 0, Attack 14) Counter Attack (Range 1, Cost 0, Attack 14)
Immunity: None
Resistance: None
Glare
Health: 20
Speed: 4
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (Range 1, Cost 0, Attack: 10)
Immunity: None
Resistance: None
Thoughts Folks?
Shouldn't the horrible poll results (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=244.0) make you want to give up on Mounteds Guardsmen and Glares?
What I wanted was instructive critism, but sadly nobody as given me that oh well
Well, Zackirus, people have voiced their opinions- in terms of poll, and if someone doesn't like the idea at all, hardly any contructive criticism will follow.
Now, from this poll (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=251.0), I'll be setting the "X" to be equal to 16 for the Wraith's inhabit attack, so the stats now are follows:
"Wraith"
Health: 90
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 16), Cryo Blast (Range: 2, Damage: 19), Cryo Cross (Range: 1-2 Omnidirectional (Diamond shape), Damage: 13), Inhabit (Range: 1; Damage: none*)
Immunity: Physical
Resistance: Cold
*Inhabit can only work if the target's hp is equal to, or less than 16, works by the Wraith taking the host body, extracting the host soul, then restoring the new body to full hp.
I am thinking that this Wraith can be a boss-type enemy unit, that, for instance, we might see in Crpyt 4 (continuing the ghost leitmotif), and it's supposed to be simply a slightly stronger version of the Greater Ghost.
Any more thoughts on it folks, should I make this formulated?
Yeah that looks good to me KZ.
Now, on the topic of ghost enemys, why is Luca/the spirits in TPA2 the only ones that know Soul Suck? Or even Juxtapose? Why not make an emeny that knows one of those? Maybe Feedback instead of Souls Suck, but still.
How come now enemy Shadowlings don't have shadowport or enemies have element shields. There are some attacks that I don't think an enemy would ever use properly or have no value to an enemies team.
Phantom Healer-Made up of psy energy, some spirits become natural healers.
Health: 32
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 6), Mega Shield (Range: 1, Healing: 14)
Resistance: Physical
The melee doesn't make sense im2smart4u. Unless this sprit has a sword (which I'm pretty sure is unlikely) that would make sense. Instead why not have mind blast as it does the same thing in the end. I am assuming this spirt would look sort of like luca.
Phantom Healer- instead of making it up of Psy energy why not just have it " Sometimes healers can die and leave their spirts in the world, they use their powers to heal other spirts"
Health 32
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range 1, Cost 0, Damage 6), Mege Shield (Range 1, Cost 0, Healing 16)
Resistance: Physical
I do like the idea though and it would expand on the sprits area of Telepath.
Ok, then I'll go ahead and make Wraith formulated.
I really like the idea of the Phantom Healer, but maybe change the name to Ghost Healer so that people don't mix up the unit with phantom armor.
I also agree with Zackirus- it would make more sense for the unit to use Mind Blast. Don't forget that they are only partially present in the material plane and melee attacks deal them little to no damage, so why should the inverse be true?
I suggest:
Ghost Healer
Health 32
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range 1, Cost 0, Damage 6), Mege Shield (Range 1, Cost 0, Healing 16)
Resistance: Physical
Quote from: Zackirus on March 26, 2010, 04:44:03 PM
How come now enemy Shadowlings don't have shadowport or enemies have element shields. There are some attacks that I don't think an enemy would ever use properly or have no value to an enemies team.
Quote from: KZ on February 05, 2010, 07:42:43 PM
Shadowling Assassin
Health: 45
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 10), Shadow Blast (Range: 2, Damage: 15), Shadowport
Resistance: Shadow
I think this enemy has shadowport.
Quote from: KZ on March 27, 2010, 01:57:42 PMI really like the idea of the Phantom Healer, but maybe change the name to Ghost Healer so that people don't mix up the unit with phantom armor.
I don't think anyone would mix them up with Phantom armor. Phantom Healer is a better name, because there are already so many "Ghost".
Quote from: KZ on March 27, 2010, 01:57:42 PMI also agree with Zackirus- it would make more sense for the unit to use Mind Blast. Don't forget that they are only partially present in the material plane and melee attacks deal them little to no damage, so why should the inverse be true?
I think mind blast would be better, because the unit is a psy. I think you forgot that the Ghost Knight (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ghost_Knight) can do a power melee attack.
Phantom Healer-Made up of psy energy, some spirits become natural healers.
Health: 32
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 6), Mega Shield (Range: 1, Healing: 16)
Resistance: Physical
Then I guess we'll also have to explain the difference between "Phantom" and "Ghost". But I do agree that it sounds better.
Ah, you're right- I completely forgot about that unit. However, I think it can still be explained away- had a Ghost Knight been fully in the material plane, he would've dealt twice as much damage, so it's just that it is a very powerful melee unit.
I like the Phantom Healer, quite a lot, actually. How about the rest of you, folks?
I like the idea and I would support it!, but I would want to call it a Phatom Healer because it just sounds much nicer than ghost healer. Though I think It sprite should look like Luca.
Quote from: Zackirus on March 31, 2010, 08:23:23 AM
I like the idea and I would support it!, but I would want to call it a Phatom Healer because it just sounds much nicer than ghost healer. Though I think It sprite should look like Luca.
Maybe Luca-ish instead of an exact same sprite.
Do any of you guys remember the multiplayer characters from Telepath RPG Chapter 2? The Psy Assassin is the one I'm pointing at here, they might be medium-level rogues from the Academy and the stats are as follow:
Psy Assassin
Health: 26-30
Speed: 7 (they shouldn't move as fast since they would be on you in the first turn that way)
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, damage: 7) Feeback (Range: 2, damage: ?) Psy Bolt (Not an attack) (Range: 2, Damage: 10)
Resistance: Mental (Slight)
Just to point out, Duskling- this has been advocated, by im2msart4u, and has been added to the formulated enemy ideas thread, I believe. (Or, at least, it has been debated).
So, let's see if we can make Phantom Ghost formulated?
I was thinking Lesser Ghost appearance for this unit- it will make it more likely to end up in game if Craig doesn't have to spend the extra time coming up with plausible AI and new graphics.
Monk
After years of training, these warriors have come out out of isolation weilding a simple staff. Be warned though. These guys are and deadly with their staffs
Health: 60
Speed: 3
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (Range 1, Damage 18, Cost 0) Pole Slash (Range *Front Three Squares*, Damage 18, Cost 0) Counter Attack (Range 1, Damage 18, Cost 0)
Resistance: none
Shaman
These simple people have also joined the monks. The may not be good at their staff attacks, but they can heal many targets at once and are very annoying.
Health: 65
Speed: 3
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 12, Cost 0) Mind Shield (Range 1, Heals 18, Cost 0) Long Shield (Range 1-3, Heals 18, Cost 0)
Resistance: none
Pole Slash
XXXXX
XOOOX
XXMXX
XXXXX
X = Unaffected Space O= Affected Space M= Monk Facing North
Thoughts, Ideas, Improvemnts?
How does the monk and shaman fit into the story?
I'm guessing, but the monk could be a low rank in the Cult's priestly-hood, and the shaman could be a psy user in either the Marid or Rubat clan
Ravinale ninja
Health: 40
Speed: 4
PsP: 0
Attacks: melee (30 damage), leap
Counter: meele (30 damage)
Resistance: mental
Quote from: Zhampir on April 05, 2010, 05:30:57 AM
I'm guessing, but the monk could be a low rank in the Cult's priestly-hood, and the shaman could be a psy user in either the Marid or Rubat clan
I was more thinking that a monk would be a person who has lived in the in the mountains near Somnus (in isolation) because the mountains look kind of important. The shamans would be like monks, living in isolation. They could come into the story because Craig has left out those mountains. I also think these guys would appear in some sort of side quest. Thoughts
Dorgon 5000, I think that the Ravinale Ninja is just like an improved version of the assassin, maybe if you spice it up a bit (new attacks/ special abilities) it would be cool and original.
Mister Happy
Health 25
Speed: Over 9000
PsP: 0
Attacks: Explosion--
Effects: u ded
What about this?
Ravinale ninja
Health: 40
Speed: 4
PsP: 0
Attacks: stab (30 damage), whirlwind (50 damage), shurkien (20 damage)
Counter: meele (30 damage)
Resistance: mental
The strategy for this one is a bit tricky. You need to avoid the shurkiens through hiding behind bushes, trees and other things. It´s also inportant not to stand closely to an ally, because his whirlwind attack is very strong. If you stand next to him, he will backstab you. If you stand one step away, he will do sidestab. If you have a range three attack, use it. A good opition is to take him from where he can only use shurkien, like on the other side of a water. The esiest way is still to backstab him, he has not very much defense compared to his other stats.
Eek!
You don't get into the specifics of what anything does, and he does too much damage, and has too little health. Enemies in TRPG games have a lot of HP but don't deal much damage.
That´s the whole idea, making a very offensive enemy because there are no such in the telepath games. And all the attacks have already been used in telepath, exept for the shurkien, which is like laser blast but hits only one target.
Quote from: Zackirus on April 04, 2010, 02:35:39 PM
Monk
After years of training, these warriors have come out out of isolation weilding a simple staff. Be warned though. These guys are and deadly with their staffs
Health: 60
Speed: 3
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (Range 1, Damage 18, Cost 0) Pole Slash (Range *Front Three Squares*, Damage 18, Cost 0) Counter Attack (Range 1, Damage 18, Cost 0)
Resistance: none
Shaman
These simple people have also joined the monks. The may not be good at their staff attacks, but they can heal many targets at once and are very annoying.
Health: 65
Speed: 3
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 12, Cost 0) Mind Shield (Range 1, Heals 18, Cost 0) Long Shield (Range 1-3, Heals 18, Cost 0)
Resistance: none
Pole Slash
XXXXX
XOOOX
XXMXX
XXXXX
X = Unaffected Space O= Affected Space M= Monk Facing North
Thoughts, Ideas, Improvemnts?
a couple of pages back i already came upwith priest of yawah why do we need a monk or shaman
a monk is lower than a priest.
as I said, the shaman need not even be affiliated with the Cult.
The Ninja is basically the superpowered version of the Guard with less HP.
Quote from: Zhampir on April 06, 2010, 06:58:32 PM
a monk is lower than a priest.
as I said, the shaman need not even be affiliated with the Cult.
I did not say that the Monk was lower than priest or that they were connected to the cult at all. I was simply proposing an enemy that cam from the mountains near Somnus (not a fighter who works for the cult). Moreover, I do think the cult does need another enemy type, and as Torugo suggested why can't we have a priest that would do fire attacks against the main (for some reason only 2 enemies have a fire affinity). The Ravinville Ninja, to me sounds like a very cheap enemy. I would prefer an enemy only to have two attacks (counter attack not included). Although if you morph the stats a bit, I'm pretty sure you could make him into boss, maybe the leader of the Black Rose perhaps ;)
The monk and shaman sound like generic fighters and healers.
Quote from: WeBing on April 06, 2010, 09:09:30 PM
The monk and shaman sound like generic fighters and healers.
I think their more advanced than that, having upgraded moves/health than a normal guardsmen/healers Prestentiment. I think they would be a greater challenge than compared to normal guards. Also I wanted to changes something:
Shaman: Attacks: Big Shield (Range Omidirectional, Heals: 18, Costs: 0) to replace mind shield
Though, I can change the attacks for them to become more unique
No, I meant the concept. Stats are easily suggestible.
But a Shaolin monk with a staff attack? Are you kidding me? That has been overused far too often, along with the shaman.
Light locust
Those grasshoppers return every summer to feed on crops. This results in starving and poverty for the people. They are very intelligent and they can communicate through telepath. They are not normally dangerous, but they can be if you try to kill them. They are usally found in great hordes. You could have a sidequest (or a normal quest) in which you help a farmer getting rid of them.
Health: 20
Speed: 3
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (6 damage)
Resistance: light
Light locust solider
A stronger version of the previous one.
Health: 50
Speed: 3
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (16 damage), slash (16 damage)
Resistance: light
Light locust magican
Health: 30
Speed: 3
PsP: 0
Attacks: Mind blast (8 damage), Light blast (12 damage), Light bomb (8 damage)
Resistance: light
This is fairly similar to the Wraith idea, but what about a Banshee? Maybe it could look a little bit like Luca, but only a little bit so that there would be no confusion.
Statistics:
Health: 30
Speed: 5
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 7) Screech (Not an attack) (Range: 2, Damage: 12)
Resistance: Physical
Quote from: Duskling on April 15, 2010, 01:28:44 AM
This is fairly similar to the Wraith idea, but what about a Banshee? Maybe it could look a little bit like Luca, but only a little bit so that there would be no confusion.
Statistics:
Health: 30
Speed: 5
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 7) Screech (Not an attack) (Range: 2, Damage: 12)
Resistance: Physical
How does Screech cause damage and not be an attack?
i think that this thread has become less useful due to the fact that CRAIG HAS THE STORY DONE
almost completely
If we all just post ideas about for different new places and different new enemies nothing will be accomplished. We should try to comment on the previous post and wait for feedback BEFORE making a dozen new ideas. For example, I might post
"I like the idea of the banshee, and think it would be possible to implement a section of the storyline that deals more with ghosts, which Craig mentioned might happen."
I would then wait to see if the idea was shut down or accepted. Then, I would submit my carefully thought out idea and hope that others would also do the curtesy of responding to it before making new ideas.
Quote from: mikew781 on April 15, 2010, 06:16:28 PM
i think that this thread has become less useful due to the fact that CRAIG HAS THE STORY DONE
almost completely
If we all just post ideas about for different new places and different new enemies nothing will be accomplished. We should try to comment on the previous post and wait for feedback BEFORE making a dozen new ideas. For example, I might post
"I like the idea of the banshee, and think it would be possible to implement a section of the storyline that deals more with ghosts, which Craig mentioned might happen."
I would then wait to see if the idea was shut down or accepted. Then, I would submit my carefully thought out idea and hope that others would also do the curtesy of responding to it before making new ideas.
I'm at a loss of where you are obtaining such information as to the completion of the game. Whether or not this game is completed is pointless to the proposition of new enemies. They need not be restricted to this one game. The is all ready a create-a-quest section... which I think will serve your needs quite adequately. If KZ (the creator of this thread) decides the subject of the thread should change, then so bit it, but please don't go off-topic. I realize your intentions are good, but going of topic (or taking your own spin off of the topic within the topic) is not helpful, nor productive.
Quote from: Zhampir on April 15, 2010, 08:36:37 PM
Quote from: mikew781 on April 15, 2010, 06:16:28 PM
i think that this thread has become less useful due to the fact that CRAIG HAS THE STORY DONE
almost completely
If we all just post ideas about for different new places and different new enemies nothing will be accomplished. We should try to comment on the previous post and wait for feedback BEFORE making a dozen new ideas. For example, I might post
"I like the idea of the banshee, and think it would be possible to implement a section of the storyline that deals more with ghosts, which Craig mentioned might happen."
I would then wait to see if the idea was shut down or accepted. Then, I would submit my carefully thought out idea and hope that others would also do the curtesy of responding to it before making new ideas.
I'm at a loss of where you are obtaining such information as to the completion of the game. Whether or not this game is completed is pointless to the proposition of new enemies. They need not be restricted to this one game. The is all ready a create-a-quest section... which I think will serve your needs quite adequately. If KZ (the creator of this thread) decides the subject of the thread should change, then so bit it, but please don't go off-topic. I realize your intentions are good, but going of topic (or taking your own spin off of the topic within the topic) is not helpful, nor productive.
I agree with Zhampir on this one. Craig still has plans for the Telepath universe and I think that he might use most of our ideas in his next game. Personally I would like to see more chaarcters who can do ice attacks (with only 3 so far in the game) but that is just me.
I aslo have an idea for the Ice Monster different character though.
Reian Health: 45
PsP: 0
Speed: 2
Attacks: Cyro Blast (Range 2, Cost 0, Damage 14) Hail (Range 2-3 both sides, Cost 0, Damage 14)
Resisatnce: Cyro
HailXXXXX
XOOOX
XOOOX
XXXXX
XXRXX
X= Unaffected Space O= Affected Space R= Reian Facing North
Quote from: mikew781 on April 15, 2010, 06:16:28 PM
I would then wait to see if the idea was shut down or accepted. Then, I would submit my carefully thought out idea and hope that others would also do the curtesy of responding to it before making new ideas.
When an idea is suggested and no one is responds to it, it means no one is interested in it. Zackirus has proven this with his 'Mounteds Guardsmen and Glare' idea. No one responded to his suggested enemies, so he made a poll (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=244.0) that showed that people didn't like his idea at all. If no one responds, then no one has anything constructive to say about it.
Your Banshee idea is almost the same as a regular Ghost, but it has Screech instead of Cryo Blast. It is also ridiculous to have a spirit faster then an Assassin, so all suggested enemies should not have a speed of 5.
How about a new ghost assassin enemy, sort of like the Banshee.
Ghost Assassin/Banshee
Health:18
Speed: 4
Attack: Mind Blast (cyro blast seems too powerful)
Resistance: Physical
my info is from the posts that suggest that Craig has almost finished the storyline.
however, i understand the need for new characters, i was just irked by the constant, random suggestions that would require entire new places to be created, and the fact that very few people seemed to do anything other than just shoot down/ignore every other post and submit their own ideas instead of giving feedback
Im2smart4u is right. People ignore or shoot down ideas they don't like most of the time.
About the reian: Where would this enemy appear? It's an ice monster, so it would seem like it would be somewhere cold. The problem is, TSoG is set in an area that seems to have a warm climate. Another question. Why don't you just use the already existing cyro cross instead of adding a new attack?
Quote from: yogc on April 16, 2010, 07:04:56 PM
How about a new ghost assassin enemy, sort of like the Banshee.
Ghost Assassin/Banshee
Health:18
Speed: 4
Attack: Mind Blast (cyro blast seems too powerful)
Resistance: Physical
I don't see a ghost assassin as possible. Who would hire an assassin with a very bad memory? He would constantly forget who is target is? Plus, why would a ghost need money?
Quote from: yogc on April 16, 2010, 08:21:00 PM
About the reian: Where would this enemy appear? It's an ice monster, so it would seem like it would be somewhere cold. The problem is, TSoG is set in an area that seems to have a warm climate. Another question. Why don't you just use the already existing cyro cross instead of adding a new attack?
I sort of got this from Zackirus, but I think they would be located in the mountains to the north of Somnus (the cold weather/ elevation could create snow).
For the New attack I wanted to be original and adding Cryo Blast would make the Reian too much like the Psy Academy Ice Guy.
I called the ghost assassin a ghost assassin because I'm not good at creating names. The ghost "assassin" wouldn't actually work as an assassin, it would just be a slightly faster ghost that would be slightly weaker than the normal ghost. To avoid confusion, let's call the ghost "assassin" the banshee from now on.
Quote from: im2smart4u on April 15, 2010, 03:16:20 PM
Quote from: Duskling on April 15, 2010, 01:28:44 AM
This is fairly similar to the Wraith idea, but what about a Banshee? Maybe it could look a little bit like Luca, but only a little bit so that there would be no confusion.
Statistics:
Health: 30
Speed: 5
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 7) Screech (Not an attack) (Range: 2, Damage: 12)
Resistance: Physical
How does Screech cause damage and not be an attack?
By that I meant that it is not an ingame attack, as in, the Banshee should have an attack like that.
here are the first three members of a mercenary group im thinking of.
zalam:a powerful female cryokinetic fighter who lost everything in the ravinale tournament.2 years later she forms a mercenary group with 6 other strange beings that are nearly as powerful as her
health:110
speed:4
attacks:cryo blast, cryo shield, and iceberg (this move is like the solid state shield)
counter:none
morcus:another mercenary who loves to absorbs life
health:95
speed:5
attacks:melee, feedback, feedback 2 (absorbs life from 2 people at his sides) absorb (can also absorb life from objects
counter none
seta:a really weird mercenary girl who can steal attacks from people and copy there appearence
health:110
speed:4
attacks:mellee, copy (steals the appearence of a enemy and inhabits there attaacks strengths and weaknesses lasts for 2 turns then automaticly changes back)
counter:none
i"ll post the others if its ok for these 3
I dropped the screech attack from the banshee since I didn't think a highly mobile unit needed a ranged attack. I also lowered the speed to 4 since 5 was more than that of an assassin, and I lowered the health to 18 since 50 was higher than a normal ghost.
Torugo, this is the new enemy ideas thread, not new characters. They don't need names. You can just call them mercenaries or cyro mercenary. I personally don't too much like the new attacks that the mercenaries use. Why not use existing attacks?
these are not mercenaries like the mechanics this is a new mercenary group that only has seven people involved total so they wont get common names like cryo mercenary. and 2nd its ok for enemy customization but not attack customization. there is nothing wrong with new moves every once in a while
i seem to recall zem the reaper in psy arena 2 having his own new attacks
Zem was a boss. Personally, I would prefer if you introduced the new moves in the new attack ideas thread first. I don't like some of the attacks your characters use, which is why I don't care much for your characters. I also think that your characters need more background. Maybe you could start a new thread explaining how you meet them or something like that.
Quote from: torugo on April 23, 2010, 10:38:47 PM
these are not mercenarys like the mechanics this is a new mercenary group that only has seven people involved total so they wont get common names like cryo mercenary. and 2nd its ok for enemy customization but not attack customization. there is nothing wrong with new moves every once in a while
i seem to recall zem the reaper in psy arena 2 having his own new attacks
This isn't a Psy Arena, so Zem the Reaper or your goofy mercenaries don't fit in. I can't think of a reasonable place to put these characters in and if I could, then I doubt it would be worth the time to put them in the game.
Speed should never be over 3, unless the character is an assassin.
i admit zalam and seta speed was a little high. but morcus gets that speed because he is a short, fast, high tempered, soul absorbing maniac.
and i had a feeling the response would be something like that so i didnt bother putting them all in. As i can now see this new group has failed and there will be no more dicussion on them. just go on with anything else that pops into your head
Since im2smart4u didn't like the idea about calling a ghost an assassin, I changed the name to the banshee. It has a speed of 4 since it will function in battle as an assassin. It is slightly weaker than a ghost but is stronger than a lesser ghost.
Banshee
Health: 18
Speed: 4
Attack: Mind Blast: Damage: 7
What about this-
Fighter
Health- 42
Speed-5
Attack- Punch-damage 10.
Fast, with a lot of health, but a weak attack.
I have an idea for a Psy Chameleon that gets resistance to the last element that attacks it. Would that be hard to code?
Quote from: Steelfist on May 16, 2010, 07:05:08 PM
What about this-
Fighter
Health- 42
Speed-5
Attack- Punch-damage 10.
Fast, with a lot of health, but a weak attack.
Speed should never be 5, and should rarely be 4.
Teleporting Psychopathic Telepath
Health 10 (he uses his mind, not his body so he's pretty physically weak)
Speed 100 (he teleports duh)
Attack: Mindflay 20+Main's Level
Quote from: Zhampir on June 07, 2010, 09:49:55 AM
Teleporting Psychopathic Telepath
Health 10 (he uses his mind, not his body so he's pretty physically weak)
Speed 100 (he teleports duh)
Attack: Mindflay 20+Main's Level
If Shadowport has a limmited range, then shouldn't Teleporting also have a limited range?
Quote from: Zhampir on June 07, 2010, 09:49:55 AM
Teleporting Psychopathic Telepath
Health 10 (he uses his mind, not his body so he's pretty physically weak)
Speed 100 (he teleports duh)
Attack: Mindflay 20+Main's Level
The map is 11x8, isn't it? So at most you need 87 speed if you had a horrible AI that wanted to step on every square of the board to get to the target.
lol, I just wanted to see this again:
Quote from: im2smart4u on June 06, 2010, 10:35:13 AM
Speed should never be 5, and should rarely be 4.
or some variant.
Anyways, I just made up a number...
He'd basically be a kamikaze... low health, charging at the enemy hitting them where it hurts with disregard to their own safety.
Quote from: im2smart4u on June 06, 2010, 10:35:13 AM
Speed should never be 5, and should rarely be 4.
such a nub
Quote from: GOD on June 08, 2010, 02:03:48 PM
Quote from: im2smart4u on June 06, 2010, 10:35:13 AM
Speed should never be 5, and should rarely be 4.
such a nub
Almost every new profile suggests an enemy with speeds greater that 3. Almost every time I have to explain how Criag says it is difficult to program AI with speeds greater than 3. I thought if I bolden and largen the text then people would see it and stop posting unrealistic speeds.
sorry... just thought you sounded wicked stuck-up
and big bold letters always make me picture somebody screaming
If new users kept breaking rules I had explain millions of times, I'd be screaming.
Anyways, what about a Helenite with a scythe that could use Thresh (obviously, powered down?)
Maybe there could be a cult boss that had a similar or same move set as Zem the reaper. After all, isn't the Jinn Ilbis supposed to be the same as a boss in Telepath Psy Arena 2? Maybe General D'Kah could have Zem's attacks. Since he would probably be one of the later bosses, he wouldn't have to be powered down that much.
Quote from: yogc on June 13, 2010, 01:34:24 PM
Maybe there could be a cult boss that had a similar or same move set as Zem the reaper. After all, isn't the Jinn Ilbis supposed to be the same as a boss in Telepath Psy Arena 2? Maybe General D'Kah could have Zem's attacks. Since he would probably be one of the later bosses, he wouldn't have to be powered down that much.
Zem the Reaper needs to be unique, so TPA2 is unique. I think Craig said D'Kah will be armed with a poleaxe.
So what was your "New Enemy Ideas"?
Since D'Kah isn't in-game yet (as an enemy), that WAS his enemy idea. But I'd like some kind of warrior with a scythe; but Zem would still be unique because the scythe-warrior wouldn't have Sap. In fact, he could even have Melee, since it's pretty much the exact same as Thresh, just to keep Zem unique.
I like the idea of a TPA2 easter egg, but im not sure about making D'kah essentailly a copy of Zem the reaper. Maybe Zems kid could be a seperate boss?
I still think Zem should be the only Reaper. There are so many other weapons to choose from like maces, flails, axes, tridents, and est.
I'd like to see a halberd weilding oppenent that yells "I am BARTA!" for a special attack that he can only use once.
It'd hit like this
OOOOO
OOXOO
OOXXO
OOEXO
"[French hallebarde , from Old French alabarde , from Old Italian alabarda , from Middle High German helmbarde, halmbarte : helm , handle + barte , ax (from Old High German barta ; see bhardh-ā- in Indo-European roots).] " (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/halberd)
First of all, I know very well that
Quote from: im2smart4u on June 06, 2010, 10:35:13 AM
Speed should never be 5, and should rarely be 4.
but 'Arman + coffee + sugar' would make an interesting easter egg (speed ~).
The general wouldn't need to have all of Zem's attacks, but I don't see anything wrong with him having just one of Zem's attacks.
I agree with yogc- he doesn't need Sap, Thresh AND Mow, but perhaps Melee and Mow, and possibly some other unique attack? Is the point of Thresh just to make Zem stand out, seeing as it's exactly the same as Melee?
Quote from: Bromtaghon on June 19, 2010, 10:53:50 AM
I agree with yogc- he doesn't need Sap, Thresh AND Mow, but perhaps Melee and Mow, and possibly some other unique attack? Is the point of Thresh just to make Zem stand out, seeing as it's exactly the same as Melee?
Thresh (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/File:Attack_Thresh.jpg), Mow (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/File:Attack_Mow.jpg), and Sap (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/File:Attack_Sap.jpg) all have scythes in the attack captions. It would be silly for a non-scyth users to have a scyth on his attack caption. Even though Thresh and Melee do the exact same thing, they have different names. Attacks like Mow shouldn't be called Mow, because it will mess-up Zem's uniqueness.
So your objection is to other scythe-wielders, and not to the uniqueness of Thresh, Sap and Mow?
Quote from: Bromtaghon on June 19, 2010, 07:56:34 PM
So your objection is to other scythe-wielders, and not to the uniqueness of Thresh, Sap and Mow?
Yes, but I also think other enemies' attacks shouldn't share the name of Thresh, Sap, and Mow. A boss can have a physical attack that attacks the three spaces infront of him, but it shouldn't be called Mow.
In the old forums I believe KZ suggested a Ghost Healer.
Quote from: Bromtaghon on June 24, 2010, 06:29:41 PM
In the old forums I believe KZ suggested a Ghost Healer.
I believe I have, though I don't remember the specifics.
Having just looked at this thread, since the time I left in early april, not an awful lot has been suggested of much use. Given that Craig does have, more or less, a good idea of where he is heading with the story, methinks the focus should be on a) expanding existing sets if they're found lacking, like ghosts were and animals are b) trying to guess what interesting ideas we can throw in for existing, but yet unseen factions (eg Helenites, the new golem idea, etc) c) just generally coming up with new and inetersting units for side-quest, etc, as well as filling up holes in existsing sets (ghost healer, for instance). Effectively, anything that adds variety and is worth having a look at is a go- then it will end up in formulated and attempt to tempt Craig to spend this extra bit of taking of incorporating into the game.
Just to give some imput into the actual topic, how about breaking the "unspoken" rule of enemy AI is limited to 3 steps and suggest the following:
Gelf has a bird which he can summon in battle, that little beast has certain stats flashed out in the main mission collab thread, and since both Tigs and Nymphs appear as enemies, why not make this bird available as an enemy as well? The uniqueness can be that it can attack anyone on the map because it's speed allows it to cover the entire map: thus the enemy AI will simply not be limited to number of steps and this will be the omnipresent enemy, in a way? What do you think of this?
Craig, would it be possible/relatively easy, to code in such AI?
And Gelf's bird will have speed, say, 10 (or 11, to practically cover the whole map), to ensure that it can be used for its primary purpose- a deus ex machina support unit which will deliver that extra tiny bit of damage to the enemy in a dire situation (the stats suggested were low attack, say 5, relatively low health, circa 20, and maybe an extra attack that would allow the bird to lunge forth at the enemy).
What about walls? If there's a big wall in the middle, then technically it shouldn't be able to attack enemies on the other side, since a unit with ~speed (which is probably what the bird is, except for with less coding) wouldn't be able to.
Deadly unit: name a unit 'Sugar High Arman', give him the ability to move anywhere, and give him Mega Stab. Watch your back!
Well, as with the rest of the enemy AI who can't move through walls, naturally the obstacle part of the enemy AI will be kept the same, but the speed restriction will be lifted, so that the bird will be able to fly anywhere it wishes on the map, as long as no obstacle is truly in the way.
Heh, well, at least he's high on sugar, and that wears off quickly- no need to watch for him all the time. ;)
I know there were some concerns about preserving the originality of the Telepath series, but I got the idea of a vampire-like creature. A Jinn possessing a human body that, instead of drinking blood, Saps Health from Psys (using the Sap attack that Zem uses.)
I like the bird idea. Here are my suggestions for stats:
Health: 30
Speed: NaN
Attack: Air strike (10 damage)
Resistance: none
The air strike attack works just like a leap, but it hurts the character it´s used on.
So it's basically a range two attack?
It´s one range, but you move over the target. As I said, it works a bit like a leap, but it deals one range damage at the same time.
What about swamp ghosts (it was posted in the "lost areas" topic at first)?
Swamp ghost:
Health: 10
Speed: 2
Attack: Dark breath (12 damage)
Resistance: Physical
Immunity: Dark
Reinforcement: 5 turns
A very fragile, but incredibly crafty, ghost found in the bog. Invisible, except for in battle.
Why would a ghost be any different for dieing in a swamp? Why would a ghost have a spriggat attack?
Quote from: Dorgon 5000 on June 26, 2010, 03:23:47 AM
It´s one range, but you move over the target. As I said, it works a bit like a leap, but it deals one range damage at the same time.
So it's like this?
BPO
Where B is the bird, P is the player it's attacking and O is the square it lands on?
Since it has unlimited movement, why wouldn't it just move to behind the player and attack it there, doing backstab damage and not leaving its back exposed (at least to that player anyways)?
As for the swamp ghosts, I agree with im2smart4u.
Quote from: im2smart4u on June 26, 2010, 09:02:00 PM
Why would a ghost be any different for dieing in a swamp? Why would a ghost have a spriggat attack?
I think bog should have it´s own, unique creatures. it would become more mystical. But maybe another ghost unit is not the best idea.
I'd agree, we'd need new unique monsters, maybe the Praying Mantis, but it still doesn't explain how a ghost that died in a swamp would be different. As for Dark Breath, maybe that should also be unique and left to the Dark Spriggats.
As for my vampire that never got noticed, I'm trying to design some stats. It would have high health (around 50-60), being a spirit reinforced by a physical body, with Shadow Blast and maybe an attack that's like Sap, except it decreases Max PsP instead?
I'm with im2smart4u on the ghost idea. Shadowling loyalists or some other group, say some kind of bandit folk from the north- why not?
On the bird idea, I take it Dorgon 5000 that you took the areal attack from discussion on previous threads for Gelf?
The idea is that the bird physically attacks someone from range 2, then comes back to it's original space. We were toying with the idea of having simple melee equivalent, like "claws" that deals about 5 damage initially (c'mon, a practically omnipresent teammate? Needs to be balanced, methinks) and couple that, possibly, with a ranged attack. After all, the bird is so fast that it can swoop in and out faster than anyone can react and retreat to a safer spot if need be- this will make this a physical equivalent of an elemental blast, but with a uniuqe implication that the bird can put some distance between itself and the enemy unit before the enemy unit can respond. Point of interest, this is.
What do you think, folks, of this idea?
I'm fine with it.
Anyway, I have a new enemy idea. I was thinking we needed a trap enemy to expand on the mechanic sector of the game
Energy Cube:
Health: 40
Speed: NaN (nor can it turn)
Attack: Lazer Shot 1800 (Damage: 14, Range: Straight Line 180 Degrees)
Resistance: Mental
Immunity: None
Lazer Shot
000X000
000X000
000X000
000C000
000X000
000X000
000X000
It is like Energy Golem but it can't trun it looks like a cube and has moth health and such
Thoughts, Ideas, Comments
Still a bit too like the energy golems. But on the other hand, more units always make games better.
It is, in essence, a less and more dangerous Energy Golem. On the one hand it can attack two sides at once. On the other hand, it can only attack two sides, not four. And it doesn't really seem like a trap... A trap would be more like im2smart4u's mine idea, an enemy that only counterattacks.
Also: are Energy Golems immune to Mental?
Maybe it's because they have some sort of "logic core" that allows them to think which you flood with junk thoughts.
Quote from: Bromtaghon on June 29, 2010, 04:52:30 PM
It is, in essence, a less and more dangerous Energy Golem. On the one hand it can attack two sides at once. On the other hand, it can only attack two sides, not four. And it doesn't really seem like a trap... A trap would be more like im2smart4u's mine idea, an enemy that only counterattacks.
Also: are Energy Golems immune to Mental?
I could make it attack on all four sides, the thing is immune to mental because it doesn't have a brain/crystal power soruce fueling it thus the main can't overload its processors
Don´t you think that Dorgon golem should be finished now? I mean, this is a long time since chapter 2, and it must have been taken i production. It could be a very challanging enemy, as it uses a long, strong, attack and can walk at the same time. Stats:
Dorgon:
Health: 20
Attack: Energy blast (15 damage)
Speed: 3
Resistance: none
I think facing Dorgon would be pretty difficult. It could cover up to 7 rows or columns (going 1-3 in any direction or just staying put) of the map in a single turn. Kind of dominates the playing field.
Dorgon's speed should be lower. Maybe one or two. True, the player Dorgon's speed is 3 but player character's speeds are always higher (i.e. Shadowlings + Spriggats)
What about this one?
Dorgon:
Health: 28
Attack: Energy blast (15 damage)
Speed: 2
Resistance: none
Sounds pretty reasonable; maybe lower the damage a bit? It depends where it goes into the game.
It will go into in the Helenites Base which might be a bit later in the game. Coupled with many gliding archers!
Depending on when the Helenite Base becomes available, the stats might be too strong or (more likely) too weak. Although I'd prefer the Helenites joined us, rather than attacked us...
Hmm, well, it will likely be possible to fight them, so the idea doesn't have any problems there.
Quote from: Steelfist on June 30, 2010, 11:31:58 AM
Hmm, well, it will likely be possible to fight them, so the idea doesn't have any problems there.
I agree that it is more likey that you will have to fight them then they would join you (unless we had the money of course!)
Mmm, folks, just to let you know, Dorgon has already been suggested a long time ago and has been in the formulated enemy ideas thread for some time.
What of Gelf's bird unit then? Any thoughts on that (see description on previous page and on old Gelf-related threads)?
I think Gelfs bird thing is good, but it should have a little more health, IMHO
Fair enough, if it deals little damage, it might as well get a bit more initial health, otherwise it will get killed in one turn. Though don't forget that the plan is for the pet's health to be increased with Gelf's psy attack and psy defense stats, so that was the reason for initial low health proposition.
But given that now we look at an omnipresent enemy, methinks giving 28 health would be sufficient.
Works for me
What about this?
Gelf bird
Health: 40
Speed: NaN
Attack: Air strike
Resistance: none
I think there should be some shadowling loyalist like hidind in Somnus :-*
I believe this is a thread for 'New Enemy Ideas.' An idea for a Shadowling Loyalist hiding in Somnus is quite interesting but that would belong in the quest ideas (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=88.0) thread. Thank you for your input.
Dorgon- the health is too high for the bird, these enemies will be quite hard to overcome otherwise given that they can strike a target anywhere on the field, practically!
Gelf bird/eagle
Health: 28
Speed: 12
Attack: Claws
Resistance: none
That's probably more like it.
Thoughts, folks?
What about:
Murderer.
Health: 35
Speed: 4
Attack: Knife
Resistance: none
Like a weaker version of the assassin. Might be useful if you come into conflict with the Black Rose,
Quote from: KZ on July 02, 2010, 05:18:55 PM
Gelf bird/eagle
Health: 28
Speed: 12
Attack: Claws
Resistance: none
I thought it could move anywhere? In which case, its speed should be 87 (11 x 8 - 1), eleven and eight being the dimensions of the battlefield, which would allow it to move anywhere but not over walls. I'm not sure where you got twelve from, though.
Quote from: KZ on July 02, 2010, 05:18:55 PM
Dorgon- the health is too high for the bird, these enemies will be quite hard to overcome otherwise given that they can strike a target anywhere on the field, practically!
Gelf bird/eagle
Health: 28
Speed: 12
Attack: Claws
Resistance: none
That's probably more like it.
Thoughts, folks?
i could kill that in one hit! With ANYBODY! The health should be leveled. Maybe 20+(3*Player Level)?
It depends on when the mission takes place, mikew- if it's available from the start, that might be reasonable.
I like how the Crypts have mandatory switches that require a certain amount of Psy Power- that's a guideline of how strong your characters should be.
I think the bird's stats are fine.
Why does the bird have a speed of 12? Why not 3?
I think we should wait for the new Wood-Folk to give his bird a name before we make the bird an enemy.
I placed 12 as a stand in (didn't have time to work out the proper min number of steps required to cover the whole map). The "proper" number should be 11+7=18 then, this way the bird can get to any area on the map.
im2smart4u- I agree that the name and teammate stats should come first, but this was thrown in to liven up the ideas and give some new food for thought- like an enemy who can cover the entire map in one go and, hence, attack anyone, anywhere, as long as there are no obstacles on the way. Might be difficult to code, might not be, it would be interesting what Craig would say of this.
And indeed, the stats will depend a lot on where in the game one might encounter such an enemy. Forget not though that these "birds" can go after any wounded teammate, so if you cannot kill them quickly, they'll descend on your teammates and kill them off before you can react and deal with them- at least you can run away from other enemies on most of the other maps.
I see where KZ is coming from as the bird could attack any opponent on the battlefield but I also see where im2smart4u is coming from (on the speed part). Why not instead we give the bird an attack that lets it attacks anyone from anywhere on the board. It might be also difficult to code that attack but wouldn't make a compromise.
For the eagle, one needs to at least change its attack to melee, since every physical attack directly infront of an enemy unit is melee.
Quote from: im2smart4u on March 17, 2010, 10:45:16 PM
Blurp- A large toad that are found in the bogs and forests of Cera Bella. It can leap great distances to catch its prey. Known to cause massive damage, the monster's tongue can be launched at great speeds at a target.
Health: 35
Speed: 2; Leap
Attacks: Tongue Strike (Range: 2, Damage: 8 )
This unit had as much poplularity as the Wraith, so why wasn't it Formulated?
I also think the Formulated
Thorny Vines should change the name to
Thorny Vines/Cactus, so the destructable battlefield object can be in multible regions.
Well, melee is the one I was thinking of originally, but there was talk of a second attack. However, if the bird (in case of teammate) can attack practically everywhere on the field, methinks it is, indeed, better to keep this unit as simple as possible and equip it with just melee.
That's quite easy to answer- when Blurb was discussed, I left the forums and it was forgotten a bit. Plus, as far as I remember, people didn't find the name a bit ludircrous. However, let's see what folks say now- if it's a yes, then we go for it and I'll add it to formulated.
Fair enough, I'll add that in.
@KZ: 18 doesn't allow it to go anywhere if you factor in obstacles.
I like the idea of a frog, especially to add new enemies into the Great Forest.
Well, it would be a bit strange to put NaN to the bird stat, and I did use simplified logic there to give some place-holding number. Still not sure what that number should be, if anything?
From another thread, the suggestion arose to call the bird "Oris", so I'll call it by its temporary name, for now.
Oris
Health: 28
Speed: NaN
Attack: Melee
Resistance: none
How about these stats, now?
And I guess the actual pet bird for Gelf can be equipped with extra attacks, if need be.
I don't mind the frog, though the name sounds a tad silly to me (though I believe that was the orginal intent?).
I think 51 is the highest number it could possibly need, can anyone else find anything higher?
Will the health be influenced by the players level?
For the enemy- probably not. For the summon- Oris will probably get stronger as Gelf (not Duvalier) levels.
Quote from: Bromtaghon on July 04, 2010, 01:51:12 PM
For the enemy- probably not. For the summon- Oris will probably get stronger as Gelf (not Duvalier) levels.
Correct, that's the idea. The attack stats will level with Gelf Psy Attack, and hp will level with Gelf Psy Defense.
However, for the enemy the stats will be fixed. I think that as an enemy unit, Oris would be quite a major annoyance to have, but will add an extra dimension and compensate for the relatively low speed of the rest of the enemy units and provide an additional factor for a player to worry about (imagine a map with 10 Orises? What a nightmare!).
In my opinion, Oris should be used as a scapegoat. This would inspire more tactics in overall game play. Say that most of your teammates are low on health and the Main or Set needs to heal them. However, by gathering everyone together, the player risks getting attacked or surrounded by enemies. Oris or multiple Orises (?) could lure enemies away, giving your teammates enough time to escape. After that, Oris could either escape or possibly be recalled by Gelf.
My main reason that Oris should be used for this purpose is Oris just seems like a faster assassin with the proposed stats above. With a high enough attack damage, it could probably single-handedly defeat multiple enemies. It would just be overkill with Oris and Arman. Where would the strategy of the game lie in then? In addition, why does Oris have more health than a bandit? It just seems rather awkward that a bird has more health than a man (unless Oris is some huge predator). Nevertheless, I like the idea.
Has the idea of an enemy with damage reflection been discussed? If not, I was thinking something like:
Shadow Golem
Health: 55
Speed: 1
Attack: Melee (melee, 14 damage)
Counter: 50% damage reflection.
Resistance: Shadow
Description: If you try to hit a shadow, you'll just hurt yourself.
Placement: Possibly the result of the combined efforts of the mechanics and the Shadowlings, could this be used for a sentry, but tank unit rather than the simple Shadowling?
Welcome to the fourms, Anon!
I just would like to point out that the stats above are for the enemy Oris- which will have the ability to attack anyone on the map (unless the unit is completely surrounded by obstacles) and therefore give the enemy units an equivalent of Arman on the map. Thus, the player will have to deal with effectively an omnipresent enemy, and it will be quite a new tactical challenge, methinks. (I honestly think that the pain required to re-work the code for max speed limit will well be worth the final effect, as there is no enemy that presents the same type danger to the player.)
Now, the Gelf's Oris would have a much lower stats for health, for starters (say 20), and it will have range 10, with melee attack (which will also be rather weak, around 5-7), so it will not be able to kill many enemies, but could be used to finish off a major threat (e.g. Dark Spriggat with 3 health or a boss with Vendetta/Vengeance and very low health). Thus, it's a much more niche teammate than Arman, and a tad less versatile. However, the stats will scale with Gelf stats, so, given how the enemis will have very high health and high damage, it will be possible to bring Oris to a decent level in order to withstand enemy counterattack.
Ah-har ye matey I do believe that's what I was trying to accomplish with my Teleporting Psychopath (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=26.msg8580#msg8580). Although I like your bird (who has a Latin name for a mouth) idea much better. Besides mine was more of a joke to try to get people to think outside of the whole 3 speed thing (seemed that too much emphasis was being placed on that, if we're trying to separate all the enemies into separate niches then by giving the majority of them the same speed fails that goal.)
I don't like teleporting (or infinite steps), because it removes strategy from a game based on strategy. No matter how you move your characters, the enemy will appear behind them. It will be a game of trading hits.
Quote from: algebra15 on July 05, 2010, 06:51:24 PM
Placement: Possibly the result of the combined efforts of the mechanics and the Shadowlings, could this be used for a sentry, but tank unit rather than the simple Shadowling?
The overall enemy concept I am okay with it is just the back story of it. Why would the Mechanics care about Shadowling's affairs and vise versa. I just don't see it working together
Quote from: Zhampir on July 06, 2010, 11:07:53 PM
Ah-har ye matey I do believe that's what I was trying to accomplish with my Teleporting Psychopath (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=26.msg8580#msg8580). Although I like your bird (who has a Latin name for a mouth) idea much better. Besides mine was more of a joke to try to get people to think outside of the whole 3 speed thing (seemed that too much emphasis was being placed on that, if we're trying to separate all the enemies into separate niches then by giving the majority of them the same speed fails that goal.)
I also agree with im2smart4u that it does remove strategies but I do like the idea of more creatures with high speed
QuoteWhy would the Mechanics care about Shadowling's affairs and vise versa
For money, of course.
Quote from: im2smart4u on July 07, 2010, 03:19:46 PM
I don't like teleporting (or infinite steps), because it removes strategy from a game based on strategy. No matter how you move your characters, the enemy will appear behind them. It will be a game of trading hits.
H = Hero
X = Wall
O = Oris
E = Empty
XOE
XHE
XXX
No matter where Oris moves, the Hero can hit it without exposing his back.
Loyalist Commander
Health: 70
Speed: 3
Attack: Mind Blast (Mental, Range 1, 18 damage), Shadow Blast (Mental, Range 2, 20 Damage), Dark Vortex (Mental, Ranage 3x3, Damage 20)
Counter: None
Resistance: Shadow
Description: Light Blue Shadowlings with two horns and the Loyalist Mask (Mask that only covers one eye)
These are the leaders of the Loyalists. They are old Shadowling Guardians which survived the orginal Shadow Wars. This idea was spawned from the Shadowling Guardian forum.
Quote from: Bromtaghon on July 09, 2010, 04:42:01 PM
Quote from: im2smart4u on July 07, 2010, 03:19:46 PM
I don't like teleporting (or infinite steps), because it removes strategy from a game based on strategy. No matter how you move your characters, the enemy will appear behind them. It will be a game of trading hits.
H = Hero
X = Wall
O = Oris
E = Empty
XOE
XHE
XXX
No matter where Oris moves, the Hero can hit it without exposing his back.
So your solution to fighting Orises is to have every teammate always have their backs to rocks or walls? That is impossible to do in almost fights unless keep your charcters at the borders the whole time. Infinate steps enemies will limit the teammates movements to nothing or it will be a game trading attacks.
Quote from: Duskling on July 09, 2010, 08:46:17 PM
Pirate
Health: 40
Speed: 3
Attacks: Attack (Regular sword attack), Stab (It should have the same animation as Gamblin' Jack's "Snake Eyes" attack), and Summon (Summons an extra crew member or parrot (really, those things can cause injuries!))
Resitance: None
Description: They look like Pirate Pete (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Pirate_Pete) and are involved in a side quest involving Malis' spice trade, as in stealing it, or, if they were buisness partners, take it all for themselves.
I think the Summon ability has been discounted before as it would be to hard to code
What do you think of this?
PirateHealth: 40
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range 1, Damage 10), Stab [by Stab I am assuming like Arman's Stab](Range 1, Damage Front: 9, Damage Side: 12, Damage Back: 18)
Counter: Melee (Range 1, Damage 10)
Resitance: None
I couldn't kill Pirate Pete, I'm sorry they can't look like him
Quote from: Duskling on July 09, 2010, 08:46:17 PM
Pirate
Health: 40
Speed: 3
Attacks: Attack (Regular sword attack), Stab (It should have the same animation as Gamblin' Jack's "Snake Eyes" attack), and Summon (Summons an extra crew member or parrot (really, those things can cause injuries!))
Resitance: None
Description: They look like Pirate Pete (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Pirate_Pete) and are involved in a side quest involving Malis' spice trade, as in stealing it, or, if they were buisness partners, take it all for themselves.
Below is an attachment of Pirate Pete's TRPG2 figure.
I suggested pirates (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Pirate_Infestation#Enemies) before and even made a mission (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Pirate_Infestation) to accommodate them, but they never caught anyone's interest.
Summoning parrots is a really bad idea.
But you didn't suggest it on this thread, right? I felt like there needed to be a pirate, and I posted it, you didn't, sorry.
Back on Topic: Does everyone like the New Pirate (My improvements over Duskling's Idea) or would they go will the old idea?
I like the new pirate, just make the Stab do more damage up front, and it looks like the same thing as when Gamblin' Jack does a Snake Eyes attack.
Quote from: Duskling on July 09, 2010, 09:09:45 PM
But you didn't suggest it on this thread, right? I felt like there needed to be a pirate, and I posted it, you didn't, sorry.
It is not race. I suggested it in the old forums (http://sinisterdesign.freepowerboards.com/viewtopic.php?p=29432#p29432) and since few cared, I didn't repost in the new forums.
Quote from: Zackirus on July 09, 2010, 09:14:05 PM
Back on Topic: Does everyone like the New Pirate (My improvements over Duskling's Idea) or would they go will the old idea?
I don't see why pirates can't have just melee like every swordmen enemy. Pirates don't wear much armor, so their health should be much lower. Stabbing isn't the style of pirates, since they lack stealth.
a) Not everyone is from the Old Forums here.
b) Pirates live in the harsh sea most of the time, so I don't think that they necessarily have too much armor on, just that they have more endurance than most people.
I agree with Im2smart4u as pirates don't wear armour however the do need high health. Also stab is supposed to less damage to the the front because melee takes it place
New Stats:
Health: 35
Stab: (Looks like Snake Eyes)
What do you think people think?
I think that's better, just add all the earlier stats and he/she'll be good to go.
Pirates uses cutlasses (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cutlass) which are designed to slash; not stab. Also, pirates attack in boarding parties which attack from the front; not from behind which is the style of stab.
Fine, you win, post your own stats for the pirate.
you can stab with a cutlass, is just won't be as effective (unless you're very good at it, in which case a stab or jab would be very powerful). why not have two attacks, slash and stab? Slash costing some more psp but being more damaging overall?
I was thinking for the pirate that he would not only have a sword/cutlass but he would have a knife on him somewhere (It seems likely as pirates would carry both)
Quote from: Zackirus on July 10, 2010, 09:38:21 AM
I was thinking for the pirate that he would not only have a sword/cutlass but he would have a knife on him somewhere (It seems likely as pirates would carry both)
Many soldiers would carry two weapons, but they wouldn't continually switch between the two. Spartains don't continually switch between spears and swords, Marines don't continually switch between M16s and side arms, and pirates don't continually switch between cutlasses and knifes.
Yes but most of their weapons aren't two handed weapons. While holding a cutlass in their right hand they could be holding a knife in their left hand. Even if they weren't they could easily take out a knife if it was the most convient at the time.
A shortsword and dagger combo is rather good.
Where in history(or fiction) has anyone used both a dagger and a sword at the same time? No where, because a sword's range would make the dagger a hinder. Give the pirate a dagger or a cutlass; not both.
Does it matter if no one has used both at the same time, it shows that the game is creative and shows something that has never been done before. Besides the pirate is always going to be one square away from the person he is attacking. Range doesn't matter a thing as they both have the same range (In the Telepath Games).
shortsword
means it's not as long (and therefor not as heavy) as a full sword. The dagger comes in use for parrying. While you block the main attack you swing around with the dagger.
Though I find shield bashing much more useful.
On the pirate argument, methinks im2msart4u has a fair point, though we don't actually see (since Pirate Pete didn't have a weapon) what weapons in Cera Bella do pirates use. And yet, the pirate and the assassin are two very different things- the latter is a highly skilled killer, whilst the former came from all over the place, often from those who could not compete on the official and legal labour market and had different issues. Thus not many of them were likely to be skilled with the sword or any other weapon, hence sticking to melee might be a good idea here (and less work for Craig, which is always good, as it makes it more likely to be implemented in).
I don't mind seeing the pirates this much, but what plot elements can revolve around them?
(Docks in Ravinale, Lake Alto?)
For Oris, having only one enemy with far reach won't take away the strategic element, especially since, if you think about it, it reflects much better on the real world situation- when one country had conventional armies and another had ICBMs, we have the equivalent of "other enemy units" and "Oris". Furthermore, this will require thought on the part of the player on how to initially position one's troops as to esnure that, if Oris attacks a teammate, an Oris will be dealt with on the very next turn, or that the teammate can get help/escape (think of Malis going into an obstacle-protected space, of Luca Juxtaposing Oris/teammate). Also, this evens out the playing field a bit more- after all, the player has teammates like Arman, who cover 3 times as much ground as any of the enemies, save the Ravinale Assassin. I think it's a good idea to have a potential threat from afar, and getting the player to try and deal with it. Also adds extra difficulty with keeping wounded players alive (hence, more strategic thinking in terms of keeping teammates close to healing units). This also adds incentive for Craig to give Set Recover and Malis Feedback, in order to have more self-sustaining units on the map.
Quote from: KZ on July 11, 2010, 07:40:46 AM
On the pirate argument, methinks im2msart4u has a fair point, though we don't actually see (since Pirate Pete didn't have a weapon) what weapons in Cera Bella do pirates use. And yet, the pirate and the assassin are two very different things- the latter is a highly skilled killer, whilst the former came from all over the place, often from those who could not compete on the official and legal labour market and had different issues. Thus not many of them were likely to be skilled with the sword or any other weapon, hence sticking to melee might be a good idea here (and less work for Craig, which is always good, as it makes it more likely to be implemented in).
I don't mind seeing the pirates this much, but what plot elements can revolve around them?
(Docks in Ravinale, Lake Alto?)
If we just give the pirate a cutlass/shortsword then what does a pirate become another melee unit only to be used in certain situations. Adding the dagger gives the pirate options within battlefield that gives it its own personality, thus greating a new unit. Why give a rehash of what what people have seen before.
I'm sure now that the Shadowlings aren't miltaristic any more many of them would have built bases in Lake Alto and plunder passing merhcant ships. Although it depends though, if Cera Bella is trading then who are they trading with, this leaves the option that not only they are trading within themselves but their are more contients out their...
Quote from: Zackirus on July 11, 2010, 11:16:23 AMIf we just give the pirate a cutlass/shortsword then what does a pirate become another melee unit only to be used in certain situations. Adding the dagger gives the pirate options within battlefield that gives it its own personality, thus greating a new unit. Why give a rehash of what what people have seen before.
Every human faction (The Mechanics (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Swordsman_(Enemy)), Psy Academy (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Academy_Guard), Bandits (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Bandit), Ravinale Guard (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ravinale_Swordsman), est.) has their own melee-focused swordsman. What makes pirates so special where their swordsmen have stab in addition to melee? Only assassins can use stab because only they have the skills to pinpoint and strike their enemies in their weakspots, so extra damage can be given to the enemy's side or back. Plus, a pirate doesn't have the type of skills to simultaneously use both assassin and swordsmen attacks.
Quote from: AlternativesPirate Cutlass- they have red bandanas on their heads and cutlass in their right hand.
Health: 26
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 8 )
Pirate Knife Thrower- they have blue bandanas on their heads and a dagger in the right hand.
Health: 18
Speed: 2
Attacks: Fling (Range: 2, Damage: 10)
Counter-attack: Fling (Range: 2, Damage: 10)
Pirate Captain- The Captain has the same hat as Pirate Pete and has two cutlasses; one for each hand.
Health: 80
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage, 8 ), Twin Slash (Range: rightward and leftward arc, Damage: 12)
Counter-attack: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 8 )
Okay Then, which idea does everyone like better?
Pirate Cutlass (1)
Health: 26
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 8 )
Pirate Cutlass (2)
Health: 36
Speed: 3
Attacks Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 12) Stab (Range: 1, Damage Front: 8, Damage Side: 12, Damage Back: 16)
We could have a pirate assassin, and a pirate fighter. The assassin would be like the 2nd one, with knife instead of melee and less health
So your saying:
Pirate Cutlass
Health: 26
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 10)
Counter-Attack: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 10)
Pirate Stilettoer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stiletto (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stiletto))
Health: 20
Speed: 4
Attacks: Stab (Range: 1, Damage Front: 8, Damage Side: 12, Damage Back: 16)
It Could work but what does everyone else think?
Quote from: MikeW781 on July 13, 2010, 04:31:44 PM
We could have a pirate assassin, and a pirate fighter. The assassin would be like the 2nd one, with knife instead of melee and less health
Pirates are not assassins. Why would ship to ship combat need assassins when there isn't any room for stealth or speed? If there are two pirates, then it should be one less powerful and the other more powerful like Mechanic Swordman and Mechanic Captain.
Yes, that's a good point, but, instead of an assassin, it could be a pirate sabotuer, as in, sometimes pirates send sabotuers to weaken them, but the enemy itslef will work like a sentry.
Now for an enemy idea, I propose a ninja-ish character, to balance out the pirate if the sabotuer gets rejected (to put it in simpler terms: the pirate and this ninja character are enemies and will be next to equal if the pirate sabotuer gets rejected).
(Unnamed as of yet)
Health: 20
Speed: 3-7 (depending on how fast Craig can do it and how the other forum goers review it)
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 8 ) Stab (Range: 1, Damage: 11)
Counterattack: None
These characters could be involved in a side quest started by pirates, but when you can destroy them, you have a choice: eradicate them, or join them and destroy the pirates. Good idea? Bad idea? Undecided?
Pirates and ninjas? We may as well finish off the cycle and add in a Chuck Norris cameo. Sorry, but I mean don't you think its a little put-a-fork-in-it done by now?
I don't know how to answer to that... but I still think it's a good idea, the game could use a few more assassins, what with all the brawny golems and average Mechanics or the Guards, I think that there shouldn't only be one kind of assassin.
Quote from: Barzul on July 15, 2010, 11:46:28 AM
Pirates and ninjas? We may as well finish off the cycle and add in a Chuck Norris cameo. Sorry, but I mean don't you think its a little put-a-fork-in-it done by now?
What I think he means by that the story would now be too chiclé. Besides, the are already 3 assasian type units pending: The Shadowling Assasin and Spriggat Assasin and Psy Assasin.
Your ninja suggestion is the same as the Ravinale Assassin (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ravinale_Assassin), but with melee. So what is the point?
Cera Bella seems to be culturally and enviromentally like the regions of the Crusades. Ninjas don't fit very well into that setting.
I noticed that the enemy wish list wasn't recieving much attention any more. So I decided to post my own enemy as some food for thought.
Proctor
Description: Not all psy fighters possess an elemental affinity. Some just specialize in psy techniques like these proctors. Even though they do not compare to black capes fighting-wise, they can defend themselves. They can be found at the Psy Academy training advanced students in using the Gift. Their special technique, prohibit, disables an enemy's ability to use a skill via wiping their memories of it for an indefinite period of time.
Health: 47
Psy Points: 50
Speed: 2
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1 Damage: 17); Feedback (Range: 2, Healing/Damage: 12); Prohibit (Range: 1, Damage: 0, Cost: 10 Psy points)
Counter-attacks: None
Immunity: None
Welcome to the forums Anom! [Insert rest of greeting here] It's only been four days, ideas for enemies come and go, or are turned down by their own makers, it's mostly all about post quality, not post quantity, in the words of KZ.
I like it.
I like the Proctor, but maybe the enemy can be part of the Cult, since there are already so many Psy Academy troops.
Quote from: Anom on July 19, 2010, 03:51:17 PMProctor
Health: 47
Speed: 2
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1 Damage: 17); Feedback (Range: 2, Healing/Damage: 12); Prohibit (Range: 1, Damage: 0, Cost: 10 Psy points)
Quote from: im2smart4u on March 17, 2010, 10:45:16 PM
Blurp- A large toad that are found in the bogs and forests of Cera Bella. It can leap great distances to catch its prey. Known to cause massive damage, the monster's tongue can be launched at great speeds at a target.
Health: 35
Speed: 2; Leap
Attacks: Tongue Strike (Range: 2, Damage: 8 )
This unit had as much poplularity as the Wraith, so why wasn't it Formulated (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=27.0)?
^^ Would programming Ai to use leap be tricky? ^^
Also, to revive this thread, I would like to suggest a new unit:
Spriggat Rusher:
Meant for rushing the enemy and surrounding them, these Spriggats are quicker than most, but not as strong. They were developed to help route out the loyalists after the Shadow Wars, and are still around as a part of the Shadowling empire's military.
Health: 30
Attacks: Mind Blast, Fire Breath 1
Speed: 6
Quote from: im2smart4u on February 28, 2010, 09:49:25 PM
After being recruited by the Assassin's Cult, the Spriggat Assassins (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=114.0) are trained to move faster then they ever could. This new boost in speed will allow them to sneak behind enemy lines and simultaneously hit two targets from behind.
Frost Assassin:
Health: 48
Speed: 4
Attacks: Frost Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 10)
Resistance: Cold
Red Assassin:
Health: 42
Speed: 4
Attacks: Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: Heat
People didn't like the fast moving Spriggats in the past.
Quote from: im2smart4u on June 06, 2010, 10:35:13 AMSpeed should never be 5, and should rarely be 4.
If it shouldn't be 5, then it definitely shouldn't be 6
These units expands on the Mechanic section and gives the mechanics their own healer.
Mechanic Medic
Just because you aren't a Psy doesn't mean you can't heal people. These medics use herbs, bandages, and other sources to wipe away wounds and heal their teamates. The have short swords if they need to defend themselves.
Health: 30
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 12), Patch Up (Range: 1, Heals: 16)
Counter-attacks: None
Immunity: None
Thoughts, Ideas, Opinions?
I think we should wait for the Bandit Healer (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Bandit_Healer) mentioned in the Twitter (https://twitter.com/sinisterdesign) to premiere. Then you can model the Mechanic Medic after the Bandit's healer.
Quote from: im2smart4u on August 15, 2010, 10:58:03 AM
I think we should wait for the Bandit Healer (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Bandit_Healer) mentioned in the Twitter (https://twitter.com/sinisterdesign) to premiere. Then you can model the Mechanic Medic after the Bandit's healer.
Why would we need to model the Mechanic Healer after the Bandit Healer? The stats of the Mechanic Medic who have to be in the range of the Mechanics while the bandit healer in the stats of bandits.
Instead of "Patch Up", we should wait to see the healing attack the bandit uses.
I agree, Im2smart4U (I've never said that before). Nonetheless, it's a good idea.
With that said then, is everyone in agreeance that we should have a Mechanic Medic?
Quote from: Zackirus on August 16, 2010, 05:35:32 PM
With that said then, is everyone in agreeance that we should have a Mechanic Medic?
I like that idea. It reflects that they're not completely, or not at all, Psys, rather more like combat/infantry people. So I like it.
I like it too. I want to see more than just one type of Medic/Healer.
The medic is a good idea. Odds are there are healing herbs in Cera Bella.
Quote from: bugfartboy on August 17, 2010, 02:33:31 PM
The medic is a good idea. Odds are there are healing herbs in Cera Bella.
I'm
sure there are.
I like the medic, and agree with im2smart4u (for a change). Not to be rude, but he rarely offers solutions/ improvements, which is probably why I agree with him.
I agree too, we need to see a standard before formulating...
While the healing Mechanic is on hold, does anyone have any new enemy ideas?
What about an enemy that acts as a battlefield event? The reinforcement timer dings, and a Rain Cloud is spawned:
Rain Cloud
HP: 2
Attacks: Rain Shower (Range: Entire Field, Heals all forms of Tig 15 HP, self-destruct)
Immunity: Physical, Shadow, Light, Cold
Counter: If attacked with Cold, Ice Storm: (Range: Omnidirectional + Self, Damage: 15, self-destruct)
While it's rather controversial, I think it might make for an interesting gameplay twist.
What do you mean by Tig and self-destruct?
Quote from: mezzoforte on August 21, 2010, 03:08:58 PM
What do you mean by Tig and self-destruct?
Tig is a plant enemy that shoots spores out all around it.
Self-destruct is when something kills itself to hurt something
I'm not very attracted to the idea of a rain cloud... but I'm not against it...
(By the way, you forgot to add "mind" to the immunity list of the rain cloud.)
Like I think I might have said-- wait; I didn't. This is an idea for a type of enemy. It could be a different thing, like a medical supply cart reinforcement for the enemy, which heals all the enemies on-screen once it gets to the drop-of point -- if it isn't hijacked by your team first, in which case the counter is a heal self-destruct, showing that you got the medical supplies instead.
It's just an idea.
Another idea:
Paralytic Trap
Sprays a paralytic venom on its target. Hidden in the rocks, so it's immune to mind and physical
Health: 18
Attacks: Poison Spray (Range: 3 in front, Damage: 2, Effect: Speed - 1)
I really don't like the idea as most players would get confused about which were real rocks compared to the trap ones.
I have my own idea for another expansion on the Rainville unit set.
Rainville Shield-Bearer
These armoured warriors don't pack much of a punch but they have high health and hard to kill. They wear heavy armour from head to toe, and they only carry a shield.
Health: 70
Speed: 2
Attacks: Shield Thrust (Range: 1, Damage: 8, Special Effect: It prevents counter-attack)
Resistance: Physical
Immunity: None
Thoughts, Comments, Improvements?
It's interesting (although I don't know how easy is to disable the counter, but even if that's not possible, it's still an interesting unit).
Mmm, not sure how that can explain the unit preventing a counter-attack, really! I can see it getting reflected, or dealing less damage, but still! Methinks that's a feature that could be used for something like Stab- where the assassin is so fast, no one has quick enough reflexes to respond.
Otherwise- I don't really see an enemy with just a shield becoming an offensive unit and dealing much damage!
What I would actually like to see, is some unit which can use Whirlwind- in fact, why not a Helenite melee units all know how to perform this attack, since Helena taught the rest of them how to use it? Powerful, impressive, deadly.
This unit will definitely be a challenge, with ability to break formations and preventing the player from attacking the unit an all sides, unless they're going for a sure kill.
Helenite Swordsman
Health: 40
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 12), Whirlwind (Range: Omnidirectional; Damage: 10)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
Thoughts, folks?
At the point in the game during which it would be introduced, most people can do a sure kill on an enemy with 40 HP, because it would have to go after the execution rescue. Maybe the HP could be upped a bit?
Quote from: KZ on September 03, 2010, 06:35:16 PM
Mmm, not sure how that can explain the unit preventing a counter-attack, really! I can see it getting reflected, or dealing less damage, but still! Methinks that's a feature that could be used for something like Stab- where the assassin is so fast, no one has quick enough reflexes to respond.
Otherwise- I don't really see an enemy with just a shield becoming an offensive unit and dealing much damage!
I was thinking that the shield bearer would hit the enemy with the shield and as Griffin counter-attacks, the shield bearer would use his shield to block the blow. If that doesn't work then it would simply half the damage caused by counter-attack
It is not supposed to be a offensive unit. It is supposed to be a defensive unit. That is why it is slow and has low attack. I meant for the shield bearer to protect achers and healers.
I like your Helenite Swordsmen idea though
Well, possibly, but if it's a basic unit, then surely those guys will be of comparable strength to the Mechanics? After all, 40 is even beyond a mechanic captain! Plus, during mission 3 we fight off the Mechanics, and mission 4 is straight after that and doesn't require that much upgrading on behalf of the player. In fact, to be in line with this idea, let's call the unit a Helenite Captain, so that the health is comparable.
Plus, methinks people are overpowering their units currently by quite a lot- if we all were to play the full game, I think no one would bother waiting around mission 3 to level up their characters by quite a lot- exactly the same happened during TRPG2 testing, where people were saying that the difficulty is too easy during the later stages of the game, and I think it is partly to that that the difficulty of missions 5, 6 and 7 is quite higher than of the previous missions, forcing the player to farm for gold for quite some time. Methinks it's worth avoiding the problem, as we're already seeing quite a steep difficulty curve and too much grinding isn't really going to give much fun to players.
PS
Ah, zackirus, you posted whilst I was writing this- well, I don't mind the idea too much, and I do like the idea of an attack that blocks counter-attacks, I just simply cannot imagine realistically anyone going around with just a shield to defend/attack. That's not really a weapon with which one can hurt an enemy much. Maybe give them a knife or something as well?
Rainville Shield-Bearer
These armoured warriors don't pack much of a punch but they have high health and hard to kill. They wear heavy armour from head to toe, and the carry a heavy shield and a sword.
Health: 70
Speed: 2
Attacks: Melee (Range 1, Damage: 8 ), Shield Thrust (Range: 1, Damage: 6, Special Effect: It prevents counter-attack)
Resistance: Physical
Immunity: None
KZ, do you think this would work better?
Yep! Also, one then will have to decide when the unit uses one attack over the other, since they're both the same range.
For instance, one could also suggest Shield Thrust to be only used as a defensive measure when someone counter-attacks them (though would it be difficult to code in the ability to recognise when a counter-attack is due)? Then use melee on units who don't counter-attack (and then reduce the damage from shield thrust, or increase the melee damage to make this a tactically important step- which attack to provoke from this unit)- which will then give much greater damage.
Just to keep this idea in sight:
Helenite Captain
Health: 40
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 12), Whirlwind (Range: Omnidirectional; Damage: 10)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
Thoughts, folks?
Instead, why not have it has a passive ability, instead of a move, then their would be less programming invovled.
What if the Shield Bearer had 50% damage reduction to all attacks made from the front (except, perhaps, mind attacks). That would make sense (but it might be even harder to code than preventing a counter). An alternative, easier to code, would be a 50% damage reduction to all attacks. That would made the Shield Bearer an unit quite hard to beat in battle (perhaps well suited if we consider him an high rank unit).
I also liked the idea of the Helenite Captain .
I am for the Helenite Captain, while I think the shield bearer would be out of place, and ignored. Despite being used to defend low health units, most characters would ignore the shield bearer untill the archers and healers were dead.
Quote from: Ertxiem on September 03, 2010, 08:13:42 PM
What if the Shield Bearer had 50% damage reduction to all attacks made from the front (except, perhaps, mind attacks). That would make sense (but it might be even harder to code than preventing a counter). An alternative, easier to code, would be a 50% damage reduction to all attacks. That would made the Shield Bearer an unit quite hard to beat in battle (perhaps well suited if we consider him an high rank unit).
He already has Physical Resistance All around. How about make him have a 75% Resistance to the front.
I do consider him to be a high rank unit. I was thinking they would be personal guards of high-level priests.
Quote from: Zackirus on September 03, 2010, 06:57:53 PM
Rainville Shield-Bearer
Health: 70
Speed: 2
Attacks: Melee (Range 1, Damage: 8 ), Shield Thrust (Range: 1, Damage: 6, Special Effect: It prevents counter-attack)
Resistance: Physical
Immunity: None
What is "Rainville"? With massive health and low attack damage, this enemy will pose little danger, while taking forever to kill. He is not a spirit, so he shouldn't get Physical resistance.
Quote from: KZ on September 03, 2010, 07:09:49 PMJust to keep this idea in sight:
Helenite Captain
Health: 40
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 12), Whirlwind (Range: Omnidirectional; Damage: 10)
I like it. Most people overthink their enemy ideas, but this idea is simple and good.
Ravinallian Shield-Bearer (My Mistake)
He is a wall unit used to hamper melee units until aditional help can arrive. He has a huge, heavy iron Shield and he wears Steel Armour from head to toe. I think that a sword/arrow isn't going to do much damage.
Thanks, folks! If a couple of more people like the idea, then maybe I'll make it formulated (5 people for it, algebra17 mentioned low hp issues, let's see what he says about it after my explanation).
Ravinalian Shield-Bearer: I see the concept, and it is interesting, but really honestly, there is something which I can't quite put my finger on it which makes me agree with MikeW781 that it would be slightly out of place. Maybe take the idea of a unit which nullifies counter-attacks and apply it to another unit? Say, more in line with what see in TPA2 (after all, we already have what looks like the full Ravinale Guards layout, with Snipers and the rest making it into the game)- maybe apply this idea to Helenites instead, or to the Mechanics- a unit with heavy armor which is evidenced by Physical Resistance. Say, Mechanic Legionary (though I think the name would've better applied to Ravinale Legionary, oh well).
Quote from: Zackirus on September 03, 2010, 10:38:11 PM
Ravinallian Shield-Bearer (My Mistake)
He is a wall unit used to hamper melee units until aditional help can arrive. He has a huge, heavy iron Shield and he wears Steel Armour from head to toe. I think that a sword/arrow isn't going to do much damage.
Quote from: KZ on September 04, 2010, 07:25:49 AM
Thanks, folks! If a couple of more people like the idea, then maybe I'll make it formulated (5 people for it, algebra17 mentioned low hp issues, let's see what he says about it after my explanation).
Ravinalian Shield-Bearer: I see the concept, and it is interesting, but really honestly, there is something which I can't quite put my finger on it which makes me agree with MikeW781 that it would be slightly out of place. Maybe take the idea of a unit which nullifies counter-attacks and apply it to another unit? Say, more in line with what see in TPA2 (after all, we already have what looks like the full Ravinale Guards layout, with Snipers and the rest making it into the game)- maybe apply this idea to Helenites instead, or to the Mechanics- a unit with heavy armor which is evidenced by Physical Resistance. Say, Mechanic Legionary (though I think the name would've better applied to Ravinale Legionary, oh well).
I like the sheild-bearer/mechanic legionary idea. I think it would kinda fill a void.
I don't like the shield-bearer idea... but like KZ said, I can't quite put my finger on it too...
Ok, just to keep on the other issue as well- is anyone else liking/disliking the Helenite Captain who uses Whirlwind?
As for Mechanic Legionary- maybe someone can think of some other way in how to present the idea in-game which might be more appealing?
I like the Helenite Captain idea.
As do I, but personally I'd prefer not to have to fight a Helenite at all, but if I did, sounds like a great enemy idea!
Thanks, folks!
I'd also rather not fight a Helenite, but you never know! ;)
So far, 7 people (ie everyone who voiced their opinion) is for this enemy- let's hear from one or two more people, and I'll add this to formulated!
Mechanic Legionary
These armoured warriors don't pack much of a punch but they have high health and hard to kill. They wear heavy armour from head to toe, and the carry a heavy shield and a sword.
Health: 60
Speed: 2
Attacks: Melee (Range 1, Damage: 6)
Resistance: Physical
Immunity: None
Now they are just extremly hard to kill people, and the shield is just more of a back-drop. Do people like this idea better
Do you think they should have other resistances? A shield could help out with a few things.
Well, Most Mechanics have light protection so I guess he could have light protection
Well, I think having one resistance is enough for a unit- no other unit has more than that. Not all mechanics have Light Resistance: only one unit, in fact, the Marksman.
Sorry; I had ghosts on the brain, what with the Greaters having Physical Immunity and Cold resist.
Quote from: KZ on September 04, 2010, 01:38:54 PM
Well, I think having one resistance is enough for a unit- no other unit has more than that. Not all mechanics have Light Resistance: only one unit, in fact, the Marksman.
I said Most Mechanics have light resistance. Anyway, does everyone like the new idea or are their things still needed to be changed?
Quote from: Zackirus on September 04, 2010, 01:31:59 PM
Mechanic Legionary
These armoured warriors don't pack much of a punch but they have high health and hard to kill. They wear heavy armour from head to toe, and the carry a heavy shield and a sword.
Health: 60
Speed: 2
Attacks: Melee (Range 1, Damage: 6)
Resistance: Physical
Immunity: None
Now they are just extremly hard to kill people, and the shield is just more of a back-drop. Do people like this idea better
I still have the same issues. I don't think non-spirits should have Physical Resistance. High health combined with low attack damage is more of an annoyance then a threat. Why Legionary? Wouldn't a more appropriate name be
Mechanic Major or
Mechanic Colonel?
Legionary was suggested due to heavy armor effectively taking part of the damage. It certainly makes sense that a special unit, with very heavy armor (hence also slow) will be there- a bit like the Ghost Knight. Major or Colonel does make more sense.
Quote from: im2smart4u on September 04, 2010, 01:58:36 PM
I don't think non-spirits should have Physical Resistance.
Why can't non-spirits have Physical Resistance? I mean if you hit something really hard with your sword your sword could break.
Quote from: im2smart4u on September 04, 2010, 01:58:36 PM
High health combined with low attack damage is more of an annoyance then a threat.
They aren't offensive units, their defensive units. How would you feel if you add to take 2 of them own with their own healers and archers. If you try to kill them then other enemies kill you.
Quote from: im2smart4u on September 04, 2010, 01:58:36 PM
Why Legionary? Wouldn't a more appropriate name be Mechanic Major or Mechanic Colonel?
I think Legionary sounds cooler than Major or Colonel
Quote from: Zackirus on September 04, 2010, 02:06:12 PM
Quote from: im2smart4u on September 04, 2010, 01:58:36 PM
I don't think non-spirits should have Physical Resistance.
Why can't non-spirits have Physical Resistance? I mean if you hit something really hard with your sword your sword could break.
That sound more like high health to resistance to physical attacks. Spirits are physically resistant, because thier bodies are not solid. Solid enemies shouldn't have physical resistance.
Quote from: Zackirus on September 04, 2010, 02:06:12 PM.
Quote from: im2smart4u on September 04, 2010, 01:58:36 PM
High health combined with low attack damage is more of an annoyance then a threat.
They aren't offensive units, their defensive units. How would you feel if you add to take 2 of them own with their own healers and archers. If you try to kill them then other enemies kill you.
Ignore them and attack the healers and archers. They are much of threat anyway.
Quote from: Zackirus on September 04, 2010, 02:06:12 PMQuote from: im2smart4u on September 04, 2010, 01:58:36 PM
Why Legionary? Wouldn't a more appropriate name be Mechanic Major or Mechanic Colonel?
I think Legionary sounds cooler than Major or Colonel
Even though you like the name better, it is not appropriate name for Mechanic's miltary ranking system.
Quote from: im2smart4u on September 04, 2010, 02:14:29 PM
Quote from: Zackirus on September 04, 2010, 02:06:12 PM
Quote from: im2smart4u on September 04, 2010, 01:58:36 PM
I don't think non-spirits should have Physical Resistance.
Why can't non-spirits have Physical Resistance? I mean if you hit something really hard with your sword your sword could break.
That sound more like high health to resistance to physical attacks. Spirits are physically resistant, because thier bodies are not solid. Solid enemies shouldn't have physical resistance.
Yes but as I said, if you slash your sword against something hard it isn't going to do much damage and it much break your sword.
Quote from: im2smart4u on September 04, 2010, 02:14:29 PM
Quote from: Zackirus on September 04, 2010, 02:06:12 PM.
Quote from: im2smart4u on September 04, 2010, 01:58:36 PM
High health combined with low attack damage is more of an annoyance then a threat.
They aren't offensive units, their defensive units. How would you feel if you add to take 2 of them own with their own healers and archers. If you try to kill them then other enemies kill you.
Ignore them and attack the healers and archers. They are much of threat anyway.
Yes but what if the archers and healers are
behind them.
XXXXX
XOHOX
XOAOX
XSOSX
XXMXX
OOGOO
X= Wall, O= Blank Space, H= Healer, A= Archer, S= Swordsmen, M= Mechanic Major, G= Griffin
That makes them pretty much a un-killable wall. Even if you were able to get past him you would be pretty weak from fighting him and then the swordsmen would kill you.
Quote from: im2smart4u on September 04, 2010, 02:14:29 PM
Quote from: Zackirus on September 04, 2010, 02:06:12 PMQuote from: im2smart4u on September 04, 2010, 01:58:36 PM
Why Legionary? Wouldn't a more appropriate name be Mechanic Major or Mechanic Colonel?
I think Legionary sounds cooler than Major or Colonel
Even though you like the name better, it is not appropriate name for Mechanic's miltary ranking system.
Mechanic Major it is then. (Though I never planned for them to be higher up then Captain)
Since we can't figure this out why don't we ask other people what they think about this.
Anyone else would like to have their say about the Helenite Captain (see previous page)?
If not, it's unanimous "yay" and I'll add that to formulated later on.
For the enemy unit, this Mechanic "Major", what function will this unit perform in battle? It can be used as a tank in bottle-necks for protecting ranged units from melee attacks, but then there is the Mech. Captain for that, and would the Mechanics organisation have grown so big as to have a need for a "major"?
Well, Something has to be above the Captain. I would also assume that if you were to take on the Mechanics main base if could possibility find these guys.
Quote from: KZ on September 04, 2010, 02:53:51 PMFor the enemy unit, this Mechanic "Major", what function will this unit perform in battle? It can be used as a tank in bottle-necks for protecting ranged units from melee attacks, but then there is the Mech. Captain for that, and would the Mechanics organisation have grown so big as to have a need for a "major"?
A miltiary force must have a command struture. There is likely a Mechanic General at the top (maybe Sibelius (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Sibelius) at some point).
"Nay" for Zackirus' Mechanic Thing
Yay for the Mechanic Major.
I vote Aye.
I shall abstain from voting: although I like the idea, though I am not convinced that the said unit (Mechanics Major) is the best manifestation of the idea in the Telepath universe.
bugfartboy- what say you to the Helenite Captain (unit with whirlwind)? 1-2 more votes and it's on formulated.
I'm slightly against the Mechanics Major. It seems interesting to me but looking at his stats he's little more than a sharp rock (you can hurt yourself if you go against it, but it's easy to avoid).
Quote from: Ertxiem on September 04, 2010, 07:55:56 PM
I'm slightly against the Mechanics Major. It seems interesting to me but looking at his stats he's little more than a sharp rock (you can hurt yourself if you go against it, but it's easy to avoid).
I would agree completely if you didn't say it "seems interesting".
Let me guess: the "slightly" part is also not your cup of tea?
I'm not sure. I havn't read about the Helenite Captain yet. I'll update this when I have a vote.
Helenite Captain Update: I vote Yay.
Helenite captain/mechanic's major ideas: yay.
I vote yay on the Helenite Captain, not so sure about the Mechanic Major.
Right, folks!
The Helenite Captain goes trhough with 9 "yay"s! Thanks folks!
The Mechanic major is not likely to make the cut: so far we have 4 no and 2 yes.
I suggest the idea is either dropped, or somehow changed/re-presented in some other forum if it is to stand a chance, methinks.
how about "Sand Cat"
Health: 17
PsP: 0
Speed: 7
Attacks:
Slash: 7damage
Pounce (or flying slash of pounce is taken): moves forward one then attacks character in front of it like slash but loses two health.
(is that how I format it?)
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on September 06, 2010, 01:00:15 PM
how about "Sand Cat"
Health: 17
PsP: 0
Speed: 7
Attacks:
Slash: 7damage
Pounce (or flying slash of pounce is taken): moves forward one then attacks character in front of it like slash but loses two health.
(is that how I format it?)
7 Speed. Nay! Nay! Nay!
Cats can outrun humans anyday, and I think that's the point. Maybe they could only be included in zones where there's a fly-zone obstacle wall to hide behind.
exactly, if you insist then I can reduce it to six speed, but I've been outrun by house cats many times, and yes I was thinking along the same lines as duckling.
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on September 06, 2010, 01:13:36 PM
exactly, if you insist then I can reduce it to six speed, but I've been outrun by house cats many times, and yes I was thinking along the same lines as duckling.
In case you haven't noticed, there is only one enemy with a speed over 3. That is because it is really, really hard to code an enemy with a speed of 4. I will vote "nay" to any enemy with speeds greater than 4, because there is no possiblity it will be put into the game.
Fine, but the rest of us can vote how we like. What if I change it to three but pounce can move one or two spaces.
I agree with im2smart4u in terms of enemy speed- that will require a lot of coding by Craig, which makes chances of the enemy getting into the game quite slim ab initio.
Not sure about the cat- would it really fit that nicely into a square?
Quote from: KZ on September 06, 2010, 01:51:53 PMNot sure about the cat- would it really fit that nicely into a square?
That was going to be my second point. The enemy needs to look roundish or squareish from above. Cats, wolves, horses, and other four-legged mammels don't really fit properly in the square.
Since we have a new AI for TSoG that may be able to deal with faster enemies, I asked Craig:
Quote from: Ertxiem on September 06, 2010, 02:47:15 PM
Is the new AI from TSoG able to command (intelligently) units with speed 5 or above or should we forget making such suggestions for TSoG?
About the Wild Cat idea, I would like to see something like it. However, I didn't like the pounce attack.
Perhaps the cat could sit while not moving, as for pounce, I rather like it, because it can be positive (it moves extra) or negative (cannot fire over places such as water, but that all can change because what I really want to see is just some sort of cat in TSoG.
I really don't like the Cat idea as the ponce would take a lot of coding for the cat to use it right.
was thinking about Shadow Bugs when I realized something. There are a lot of similarities between the bug(s) and ants. However, there are ants with wings, so why aren't there bugs with wings?
Floating Bug- These bugs have grown wings for use. They also have developed harder pinschers so they can not only just attack the space in front of them. They are usually found with soliders as they help with catching prey.
Health: 50
Speed: 3
PsP: 0
Attacks: Pinscher Crush (Range: 1-3 across, Damage: 14)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: None
Pinscher Crush
OOOOO
OXXXO
OOFOO
OOOOO
What does everyone think?
I don't know about pinscer crash, it seems illogical.
I added the pinscher crush so that the unit wouldn't just be like a bug only with wings. Although from teraing at meat all day your pinschers are bound to get stronger.
Yeah, but those would have to be some fracking big pincers.
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on September 06, 2010, 01:13:36 PM
exactly, if you insist then I can reduce it to six speed, but I've been outrun by house cats many times, and yes I was thinking along the same lines as duckling.
A cat can only outrun a human for extremely short distances. Humans are actually, when well trained, the best developed species for distance running.
Aside from that, I dislike the idea because it has no background plot, and adds no originality, which would be required of an enemy that forces craig to both make an enemy with such high speeds and the pounce attack. Finally, I don't want this to be the RPG where you end up fighting common household animals because the makers didn't have any original ideas. The current enemy palette is interesting and formidable, and should be kept that way.
A sand cat would be like a mix of a cheetah and a lynx, not a house cat, also movement is reduced to three, but pounce can move two.
Some assassin enemies planned to have Leap, right? And the creature, while for aesthetic reasons, ought to fit nicely on the square, can go out of the edges from a practical perpective, like in VNOG (http://tronec.org/bmp/files/gms/online/VoyaNuiOnlineGame/Launcher.html)
The flying bug could spray some toxic gases instead, like an enlarged version of the bombardier beetle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombardier_beetle). After reading the Wikipedia, I found that the toxic gases are quite hot, thus the attack could have the fire affinity.
The main problem is that the bombardier beetle doesn't fly and it would be hard to explain how can a giant bug fly.
Is the cat found in the desert or is it used by some race (like the scorpions are used by some tribes)?
Quote from: Zackirus on September 06, 2010, 03:16:25 PM
I really don't like the Cat idea as the ponce would take a lot of coding for the cat to use it right.
was thinking about Shadow Bugs when I realized something. There are a lot of similarities between the bug(s) and ants. However, there are ants with wings, so why aren't there bugs with wings?
Floating Bug- These bugs have grown wings for use. They also have developed harder pinschers so they can not only just attack the space in front of them. They are usually found with soliders as they help with catching prey.
Health: 50
Speed: 3
PsP: 0
Attacks: Pinscher Crush (Range: 1-3 across, Damage: 14)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: None
Pinscher Crush
OOOOO
OXXXO
OOFOO
OOOOO
I will say Yay is you lower the damage, the health and remove light resistance. There are too many ultra powerful units being suggeted. I would just call the attack "Pinscher" and let the crush be assumed.
I forgot to say that the light resistance doesn't make much sense.
Expanding a bit on what I said before, I'm thinking of a bombardier flying bug (perhaps sand coloured with some redder areas in it) that is able to spray a very hot toxic gas. It may have fire affinity.
Ironically enough, the most attacks of any given element belong to the light affinity.
I think that mobile, mass produced version of Dorgon for Helenites can at least start to atone for this. We also might get a White Cape from academy with Light Bomb. Light Spriggat was suggested. Can't really see any Shadowlings with Shockwave- that seems to be Tastidian's unique light attack (that is to say, I'd like to see it used, but not by Shadowlings).
There is ample possibility of having Light Bomb used by a Ravinale Acolyte.
What area of enemy classes didn't I cover yet which might have Light attacks?
Maybe there could be a sort of light bug, one that sort of flashbangs you, just a thought though.
The mutated lightning bug. A firefly?
Hmm... I think that falls under the category of fighting animals because the forum users couldn't think of anything better. Not my words.
More like a cicada crossed with a lightning bug times a thousand ant inherntly bad tempered.
I think if we are to add a new animal, we'll have to very carefully think over why we are doing so and what's the reason for us to add that animal into TSoG.
For instance, we've discussed expanding the Shadow Bug set. We also came up with new animals for Gelf pets (the bird). The Tig came around because people agreed that there should be something between the Energy Golem and an inanimate object. What reason can we give for another animal?
Right now I cannot think of an enemy set where we can plunk in an enemy with a light-based attack.
Floating Bug
These bugs have grown wings for use. They also have developed harder pinschers so they can not only just attack the space in front of them. They are usually found with soliders as they help with catching prey. They also have a nasty, hot, gas that they can fire which they can use to take down prey!
Health: 40
Speed: 3
PsP: 0
Attacks: Pinscher (Range: 1-3 across, Damage: 10), Fire/Gas Gush (Range: 1, Damage: 12)
Resistance: Fire
Immunity: None
Pinscher
OOOOO
OXXXO
OOFOO
OOOOO
What does everyone think of this bug?
Hmm... I can't say. I sounds decent. But why wouldnt the gas do the three instead of the pinschers?
Because the gas would be fired out from the bugs mouth and it would travel straight not go off to the sides.
But even gas spreads itself out. Isn't it called diffusion? Or am I getting my science terms wrong again?
I know it complicates things a bit (at least in the animation of the attack), but I would like to point out that the bombardier beetle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombardier_beetle) elevates itself and ejects it's attack from the rear tip of its abdomen.
Lets just pretend that this bug can shoot the fire our of its mouth, not its abdomen.
Can't say I like the bug much- there isn't really a reason for it to be included in TSoG. But if it does go through, I'm with Ert on the abdonmen issue- more original that way (even if harder to animate).
Quote from: Zackirus on September 07, 2010, 05:52:13 PM
Floating Bug
These bugs have grown wings for use. They also have developed harder pinschers so they can not only just attack the space in front of them. They are usually found with soliders as they help with catching prey. They also have a nasty, hot, gas that they can fire which they can use to take down prey!
Health: 40
Speed: 3
PsP: 0
Attacks: Pinscher (Range: 1-3 across, Damage: 10), Fire/Gas Gush (Range: 1, Damage: 12)
Resistance: Fire
Immunity: None
Pinscher
OOOOO
OXXXO
OOFOO
OOOOO
What does everyone think of this bug?
I don't se the need for the Gush attack and fire resistance, but I will vote "Yay" anyway.
Yay.
lower the health to around thirty two, until then or further notice nay.
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on September 07, 2010, 07:33:56 PM
lower the health to around thirty two, until then or further notice nay.
I think the health could be lowered too.
I vote yay if you reverse the attack range and lower the health.
Ok, so who does this enemy unit associate with? What "soliders" are being referenced in the description? Where can this animal be found? Why does this animal exist? How can it be made relevant to the TSoG plot and make it worthwhile for Craig to make it?
'Cause honestly, it seems more like an enemy made up for the sake of making up a new enemy, rather than covering something that is lacking within the enemy sets on offer.
Just to remind folks- we have already formulated quite a few animals in the first place, and I have to say those formulated ideas fit in better than this one.
Old Forum Suggestions (http://sinisterdesign.freepowerboards.com/viewtopic.php?p=29432#p29432):
Quote from: im2smart4uIn TRPG2, we learn that there are pirates in Cera Bella when we meet Pirate Pete. The use of pirates could be used in missions at Ravinale Docks and missions at Lake Alto.
Pirate Cutlass- they have red bandanas on their heads and cutlass in their right hand.
Health: 26
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 8 )
Pirate Knife Thrower- they have blue bandanas on their heads and a dagger in the right hand.
Health: 18
Speed: 2
Attacks: Fling (Range: 2, Damage: 10)
Counter-attack: Fling (Range: 2, Damage: 10)
Pirate Captain- The Captain has the same hat as Pirate Pete and has two cutlasses; one for each hand.
Health: 80
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage, 8 ), Twin Slash (Range: rightward and leftward arc, Damage: 12)
Counter-attack: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: Mental
Yay for all of them. But is there like a medic pirate?
yay for all, and no, there were never medic pirates that would be unrealistic.
Shoud Knife Throw (Range: 1, Damage: 6) (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Knife_Throw) be added to the Pirate Knife Thrower?
If it's a throw then yah. Wouldn't a pirate captain keep at least one half decent healer/medic on board? Diseases run rampant you know. It could have a very low healing capability. And maybe be limited by Psi points because it doesn't hav an unlimited amount of healing herbs and such.
The Pirate Cutlass and the Pirate Knife Thrower are OK.
I don't like very much the Pirate Captain, in particular the twin slash.
I don't like very much the Pirate medic idea. It doesn't fit very much into their characteristics, from my point of view. (And if there is a medic on board, that doesn't mean that he must fight the battles.)
Quote from: Arch Preist of Craiginism on September 13, 2010, 09:32:54 PM
If it's a throw then yah. Wouldn't a pirate captain keep at least one half decent healer/medic on board? Diseases run rampant you know. It could have a very low healing capability. And maybe be limited by Psi points because it doesn't hav an unlimited amount of healing herbs and such.
If you look up anything on pirate history, then you will notice that they are not the healthest people. There will be no pirate medic.
Nay for thy medic.
I have issues with all of them:
Pirate Cutlass: I think it needs a counter attack.
Pirate Knife Thrower: Why does it have a counter attack. It just boosts the power. I was thinking that the pirate Knife Thrower should have knife throw but have the damage at 8 not 6
Pirate Captain: Why even have a melee attack. The slash is a better attack so they will be using it much more often. Shouldn't the melee do more damage as it covers less range.
However, I am maybe until he changes are made or someone can justify their reasoning.
Quote from: Zackirus on September 14, 2010, 11:01:06 AMPirate Cutlass: I think it needs a counter attack.
Not every enemy needs a counter-attack. Think of the Mechanic Swordsman.
Quote from: Zackirus on September 14, 2010, 11:01:06 AMPirate Knife Thrower: Why does it have a counter attack. It just boosts the power. I was thinking that the pirate Knife Thrower should have knife throw but have the damage at 8 not 6
It is easier to counter-attack with a knife, then a bow, yet bowmen can counter-attack. I don't think the cutlass and knife thrower should have the same 1 space range damage.
Quote from: Zackirus on September 14, 2010, 11:01:06 AMPirate Captain: Why even have a melee attack. The slash is a better attack so they will be using it much more often. Shouldn't the melee do more damage as it covers less range.
He only has melee for counter-attacking.
Ohh! Ooh! What about bad Gelf that summons shadow bugs?
Trap tile, immovable, indestructible, damages anything that walked over it, in other words the enemy of my enemy is also my enemy in this case.
What if we had a VERY fast enemy (5, per se?) that, if on any given turn, didn't attack, it would use a default attack which lowered its speed by 1?
It would be a very "use it or lose it" sort of thing. Eventually, it would become a turret enemy like Energy Golems, which is why I suggest it be a War Engine (it rusts if you don't use it), and have a range of 2-4 in any of the 4 directions. Thus:
War Engine
HP: 50
PsP: N/A
Speed: 5 (to start with)
Attacks: Projectile (14 physical damage), Rust (Default: reduces own speed by 1)
Resistance to Heat (steam engine: heat only helps it burn hotter; it's a compromise between structural damage and better working. Instead of upping the damage done by 4 for every Heat attack sent its way [althrough that would be cool], it instead just gets a 50% damage reduction. Possibly used by the mechanics. Then again, they already have their golem tank units, so maybe this can be more of a Helenite thing.
Quote from: Duckling on October 05, 2010, 06:17:11 PM
(5, per se?)
Speed: 5 (to start with)
I can already hear a debate about this. :D
As can I. This was already discussed. No speeds over 4. And even that is at a stretch. That is unless Craig expands the battlefield.
War engines cannot move five, that's barely slower than a suggested sand cat, and they're part cheetah.
No trap would be like a prssure pad, it simply releases a toxic and corrosive gas whenever it is stepped on.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 05, 2010, 06:29:05 PM
As can I. This was already discussed. No speeds over 4. And even that is at a stretch. That is unless Craig expands the battlefield.
Thank you for saying it instead of me. If I had to say "No speeds over 4" again, I might have went postal. I said it a thousands times and explained the reasons a thousand times, but some people are too dim-witted to stop themselves from posting enemies with speeds over 4. Because of the recent boneheadedness I have witnessed in this forum, I have started to lose hope about humanity's future.
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on September 28, 2010, 07:14:53 PMTrap tile, immovable, indestructible, damages anything that walked over it, in other words the enemy of my enemy is also my enemy in this case.
I thought about suggesting the spike tile (like the ones in the crypts) when I suggested the arrow trap, but I didn't because it seemed overly complex. There were too many unanswered questions about how it would work. Does it only hurt when you end your turn on it? Does it hurt both allies and enemies? If you press undo will all the damage be reversed? Unlike the Crypts, are you allowed to walk over it, or does it throw you back? Would Craig even be able to program that into the game? If Craig could program it into the game, then would it be worth the time doing?
1. No walking over it hurts too
2. Wasn't that clear, of course a trap has no brain
3. Yes, it's like that move never happened
4. No, how could it move you, it's a gas based trap?
5. YES!
I would perfer spikes over gas (so it could hurt ghost and spirits), but I am okay with a trap tile.
I'm fine with spikes if you'd prefer that, I just thought that it would be more simple to use a gas, but sure, spikes are good with me.
I like the idea, it's just
1:How will its AI work?
•Will it count as an enemy?
•How much damage will it do?
2:Will there be an animation to go with it?
•Will there be a whole,"OMG! I just got hit by spikes coming out of the ground! I'm gonna blink red real quick and have less current health now."
3:How difficult will it be for Craig to program it?
•Will it be worthwhile?
1. Yes but with infinite health (or 99999 if that is what works)
2. I think nothing much, after all it can't be broken maybe 8 or 9
3.yes that wouldn't be too hard, I'm not sure if it should be visible otherwise
4. What does that mean?
5.no idea, I'm a graphic artist
6. YES!
Can you please specify which answer is to what question?
In the order they appear, bullets and headings included.
To 4: I meant the whole shebang. The very slight knockback as the spikes hit you as you flash red for a second. And another thing, will it have it's own turn?
Oh then yes
Of course not, it hurts you as you step on it.
O=empty
T=trap
C=any character
B=both
Before move
OOOOO
OOTOO
OOCOO
During damage
OOOOO
OOBOO
OOOOO
After damage
OOCOO
OOTOO
OOOOO
Assume this character moves three normally.
I vote maybe for the Trap Idea as I don't think Craig could make it, but I think it is a interesting idea.
Here is an idea I created for the golden egg:
Chicken: - It's a normal chicken... that wants to kill you!
Health: 20
Speed: 4 (Flying)
Attacks: Peck (Range 1, Damage: 5)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Thoughts, Ideas, Comments Everyone?
a)Chickens aren't that fast.
b)Why would a chicken have as much health as a Bandit Healer (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Bandit_Healer)?
c)I have never seen a chicken fly more than 4 ft.
d)WHY WOULD WE WANT A CHICKEN AS AN ENEMY?
nay.
Its a *hem hem* magical chicken so it gets super powers. Besides, this enemy is just to add a little humour to the Telepath Universe. I think it would be pretty funny to some some chicken's in the game.
I vote yay on the chicken. You are planning on suggesting the Psi Chicken too, right Zack?
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 05, 2010, 08:50:00 PM
Because of the recent boneheadedness I have witnessed in this forum, I have started to lose hope about humanity's future.
C'mon im3smart4u, remember what happened to Mars in The War of the Worlds the book? It could be a feature that you can only get after completing the game or something. But it needs some humor.
ummm, only if it's exclusively for the Buh'Baq quest other wise no, that would just be stupid.
so what are everyone's thoughts on the trap tile
it hurts you as you step on it.
O=empty
T=trap
C=any character
B=both
Before move
OOOOO
OOTOO
OOCOO
During damage
OOOOO
OOBOO
OOOOO
After damage
OOCOO
OOTOO
OOOOO
Assume this character moves three normally.
deals seven damage to any charachter that walks on it
for all practical purposes indestructible
is invisible until it is stepped on once then you can rely on memory (or graphics if everyone's okay with that)
there are gas and spike traps
gas traps deal two additional damage but do not affect to ghosts and spirits
spike traps deal seven damage to anything
traps ignore resistances, (is that possible?) if yes then it is because they catch you off guard (what with being traps and all)
If it's a spike trap I'm pretty sure spirits/ghosts would still be resistant against it, even if it does catch them off guard.
The enemy War Engine only has to be so fast so it can actually have some speed during the battle. If it were 4, then it would go a total of 10 squares before it became a turret monster if it didn't have anything to attack. If it's 5, then it can go 15. I fully understand and acknowledge the "no speeds 5 or over" rule, but I propose an exception so the enemy works. It won't really be hitting anything on its first turn in the first place, so there's no reason for it to ever have a speed of over 4 after the first turn. Comprendes, kemosabe?
Quote from: Duckling on October 06, 2010, 05:52:44 PM
The enemy War Engine only has to be so fast so it can actually have some speed during the battle. If it were 4, then it would go a total of 10 squares before it became a turret monster if it didn't have anything to attack. If it's 5, then it can go 15. I fully understand and acknowledge the "no speeds 5 or over" rule, but I propose an exception so the enemy works. It won't really be hitting anything on its first turn in the first place, so there's no reason for it to ever have a speed of over 4 after the first turn. Comprendes, kemosabe?
If you're that worried about it not being able to hit your team, why not just set its spawn point closer and forget the initial speed of 5?
I kind of wanted this to be an enemy that would chase the player around the screen for as long as it could keep up with them. But you notice that enemies with speed 3 never use their 3 speed until they're in range of a player, so maybe the War Engine would never use its 5 speed at all, but just have it so it could keep its speed of 4 for two turns, probably long enough to get ahold of a target.
Quote from: chr0n0z on October 06, 2010, 05:37:18 PM
If it's a spike trap I'm pretty sure spirits/ghosts would still be resistant against it, even if it does catch them off guard.
Well they have no lungs so gas won't work and physical attacks still affect them but this time they can't put their guard up maybe it'll do only five damage to them.
Votes on spike/ gas trap
Yay for both I wouldn't suggest otherwise.
Yay for spike trap, nay for gas.
Too early to vote on War Engine.
Nay on war engine. Maybe on spike trap. On gas trap, I was thinking maybe it could gemlike loopy gas and have mental damage. It would affect ghosts too because as they float through it, it attacks the conscience holding the ghost together. What think you?
If it's a trap designed, set up, and controlled by psy engineers or something, why not. No comment on the war engine yet, but I do like the idea of the traps. However, I don't think spirits "put their physical resistance up" per se, they just have it. Nowhere in the wiki does it say that they have to think up physical resistance. Just an example, if I saw a ghost and knifed it, I don't think it would have much effect on it even if it didn't see me. So they'd have to have more resistance than just about 75%. I can see where you're going though, considering the fact that Luca always sees the enemy before she gets hit by a spear.
Hmm, Ithought of the spikes as having a toxin on them, that's how they do most of the damage but if you want them to not hurt ghosts as much I think one trap should at least do normal damage to ghosts.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 06, 2010, 09:27:19 PM
Nay on war engine. Maybe on spike trap. On gas trap, I was thinking maybe it could gemlike loopy gas and have mental damage. It would affect ghosts too because as they float through it, it attacks the conscience holding the ghost together. What think you?
My answer is that ghosts don't breathe
Gas trap
THN: yay
Duckling: nay
Cr0n0z: is that a yay?
Bugfartboy: Is that a nay?
Spike trap
THN:yay
Duckling:yay
Cr0n0z: is that a nay?
Bugfartboy: maybe
Okay, still not getting why people don't like the idea.
I don't see the problem with having speed 5 for the sake of having speed 4 for two turns while the machine rusts.
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on October 07, 2010, 08:46:01 PM
Cr0n0z: is that a yay?
A full yes on gas trap.
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on October 07, 2010, 08:46:01 PM
Cr0n0z: is that a nay?
Not a nay. My only point was that if you were using spike traps, physical resistance should still bring the damage down to 50%(?) instead of 75%.
===
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on October 07, 2010, 08:46:01 PM
Hmm, Ithought of the spikes as having a toxin on them, that's how they do most of the damage but if you want them to not hurt ghosts as much I think one trap should at least do normal damage to ghosts.
If you want to be fair to "non-spirits" in terms of damage received:
Quote from: Chrono on October 06, 2010, 10:25:32 PM
If it's a trap designed, set up, and (remotely) controlled by psy engineers or something, why not.
Which brings us to a new idea ;D
===
Great idea though, I'm 111% fine with it. I just had a little problem with the damage modifier. But seeing that what you intended was a toxic trap, you can choose:
- 75% for toxic trap
- 50% for normal spike trap, 100% for psy-controlled trap
- Both ^^
===
Quote from: Duckling on October 07, 2010, 09:03:29 PM
Okay, still not getting why people don't like the idea.
I don't see the problem with having speed 5 for the sake of having speed 4 for two turns while the machine rusts.
Not that I don't like the idea of the war engine, but it'd take years to convince anyone,
especially im2smart4u. No offense, because I'm not convinced either. I'd rather you set the spawn point 2-3 squares closer. It means the same thing as having a speed of 5 anyway.
EDIT: I think the reason why people don't want speeds over 4 is because it's a psychological thing. If it doesn't scare us, it will frustrate us at least. And what Bugfartboy said.
EDIT2: I changed my name to Chrono, Holy namelesskitty. Sorry for being so confusing.
At the moment, my core on the War Engine is a very strong nay. Nothing can be that fast. Especially a 10 ton war engine.
I'm maybe on both the gas and spike trap (I don't know whether Craig could program that or not)
Chrono: Welcome to the forums: use correct spelling and grammar, suggest new ideas, and have fun!
Helenite Cross-Medic
This medic is special. He has trained in the art of combat to almost the level of a regular swordsmen. He is able to counter-attack and but his healing has suffered from the amount of training.
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range 1,Damage 10) Mind Shield (Range 1, Heals 10)
Counter-Attack: (Range 1. Damage 10)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: None
Thoughts, Ideas, Comments?
Nay for Helenite cross medic.
Change the name and it'll be a yay.
I have three Ideas (take your pick):
Helenite Field-Medic
Helenite Legionare
Helenite Centurion
Gas trap
THN: yay
Duckling: nay
Crono: yay
Bugfartboy: Is that a nay?
Spike trap
now does 50% damage to spirits
THN:yay
Duckling:yay
Cr0n0z: yay
Bugfartboy: maybe
introducing the memory trap, is caused by there having been a massive psy discharge in that spot, the residual psy energy partially erases the memory of the character that steps there, does the normal 7 damage but 200% to ghosts and spirits ( their memory is what keeps them together)
memory trap
THN: yay
Okay, speed 4. That work for people?
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on October 08, 2010, 05:49:19 PM
introducing the memory trap, is caused by there having been a massive psy discharge in that spot, the residual psy energy partially erases the memory of the character that steps there, does the normal 7 damage but 200% to ghosts and spirits ( their memory is what keeps them together)
memory trap
THN: yay
Chrono: yay
Gas trap
THN: yay
Duckling: nay
Crono: yay
Bugfartboy: Is that a nay?
Spike trap
now does 50% damage to spirits
THN:yay
Duckling:yay
Cr0n0z: yay
Bugfartboy: maybe
memory trap
THN: yay
Chrono: yay
*hem hem* Nameless: I voted a maybe for all the trap ideas as I like them but I don't think Craig could create them
I am stilling waiting to hear what peope think of my Helenite Healer-Swordsmen
Quote from: Zackirus on October 08, 2010, 06:50:43 PM
*hem hem* Nameless: I voted a maybe for all the trap ideas as I like them but I don't think Craig could create them
I am stilling waiting to hear what peope think of my Helenite Healer-Swordsmen
I vote maybe.
Sure, yours sounds good, yay
Don't we vote on wether we like the idea here then Craig picks out of the ones we like and chooses the ones he can do, can I put you down for yay?
Quote from: Chrono on October 08, 2010, 07:09:26 PM
I vote maybe.
May I ask why you are voting maybe Chrono?
Nameless: Fine I'll vote yay for the trap tiles
Buggy: What do you mean, a 10-ton War Engine can't move that fast. 5 spaces is a normal person, and a 67.6 ton M1 Abrams can move at 45 mph governed, and with the governor off, can run at an astounding 80 miles an hour.
Quote from: Zackirus on October 08, 2010, 07:42:15 PM
May I ask why you are voting maybe Chrono?
I'm just curious as to why he has counterattack, but Helenites are naturally fighters so I don't mind him having that, but why Light resistance? (just curious) Also, I was just thinking it over, but if he heals less than other healers do, I'm fine with it. How about calling him Combat Medic?
EDIT: It means a yay, but I just want to hear your explanation ;)
All Mechanics and Helenites have light-resistant armour.
He will definintly heal less and do less damage than the average helenite soilder.
The counter attack can be removed as it is not a big deal.
We have four ideas for the name of this unit:
Helenite Field-Medic
Helenite Legionare
Helenite Centurion
Helenite Combat Medic
Quote from: Zackirus on October 08, 2010, 09:30:14 PM
All Mechanics and Helenites have light-resistant armor.
The only type of Mechanic that has light-resistance armor is a Marksman (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Marksman).
Im2smart4u is right. Only the marksman has light resistance. And I don't like the idea of a war engine, I'm a maybe on traps, I like the Helenite Field Medic. And introducing the Mirror Troop!!!
A cluster of (insert faction here) specializing in angles and measurements armed with a giant mirror with which they redirect the sun in large amounts.
I was thinking that a complete cluster could fit in a 3x3 tile range looking like this:
OOOOO
OOTOO
OTMTO
OOTOO
OOOOO
T-Worker
M-Mirror
O-Empty
There could be 4 stationary troops around the mirror aiming it to blind targets. I was also thinking that each troop was attacked, lowering the speed with which the mirror could be aimed, lowering the damage it does until all four are gone and it just keeps aiming in the direction that it was when the troops died. It would also, being on a swivel-typed base, be able to attack anyone who wasn't behind a wall or another impassable object. What think you? Having a very reflective surface for high damage at first, and being very large, it would be stationary and rare because of the largeness of it. Thoughts?
Explain it more clearly please. I'm having problems keeping up. Could you provide some examples?
I'll try. But tomorrow. I'm tired. I'll try to make something in editor to work with as to part of what it would look like.
Updated Stats (Light Resistnace Removed):
Helenite Combat Medic
This medic is special. He has trained in the art of combat to almost the level of a regular swordsmen. He is able to counter-attack but his healing has suffered from the amount of training in the sword.
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range 1,Damage 10) Mind Shield (Range 1, Heals 10)
Counter-Attack: (Range 1, Damage 10)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Zackirus: Yay
Chrono: Yay
Namelesskitty: Yay
Buggy: Yay
Cypher: Maybe (would change to yay if named changed [need to confirm])
Gas trap
does 9 damage to everything but spirits, spirits are immune
THN: yay
Duckling: nay
Crono: yay
Bugfartboy: Is that a nay?
Zackirus: yay
Spike trap
does 8 damage to everything to spirits, does 50% (4) damage to spirits
THN:yay
Duckling:yay
Cr0n0z: yay
Bugfartboy: maybe
Zackirus: yay
memory trap
does 7 damage to everything to spirits and ghosts, does 200% (14) damage to spirits and ghosts
THN: yay
Chrono: yay
Zackirus:yay
Quote from: Zackirus on October 09, 2010, 09:45:52 AM
Updated Stats (Light Resistnace Removed):
Helenite Combat Medic
This medic is special. He has trained in the art of combat to almost the level of a regular swordsmen. He is able to counter-attack but his healing has suffered from the amount of training in the sword.
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range 1,Damage 10) Mind Shield (Range 1, Heals 10)
Counter-Attack: (Range 1, Damage 10)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Zackirus: Yay
Chrono: Yay
Namelesskitty: Yay
Buggy: Yay
Cypher: Maybe (would change to yay if named changed [need to confirm])
Mike: Yay
Just wondering where did health 35 come in? And what difficulty is this health for? Depending on when this enemy is introduced, and what difficulty that health is for, it may need scaling up.
Mike: I was thinking a Regular Helenite Solider could have the stats of (Hard):
Health: 30
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 12)
Counter Attack: Melee (Range 1; Damage 12)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
While maybe a Regular Helenite Medic might have:
Health: 40
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Shield (Range: 1; Heals: 12)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
So the Combat Medic's Health is a an average of the the two: 35
[spoiler]On a side note: I think that the Helenite Units (All of Them) need a revamp so they are around the same level
Helenite Solider
Health: 30
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 12)
Counter Attack: Melee (Range 1; Damage 12)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
Helenite Medic
Health: 40
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1; Damage 6), Mind Shield (Range: 1; Heals: 12)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
Helenite Captain
Health: 50
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 15), Whirlwind (Range: Omnidirectional; Damage: 13)
Counter Attack: Melee (Range: 1; Damage 15)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
Helenite Combat-Medic
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage 10) Mind Shield (Range: 1; Heals: 10)
Counter-Attack: (Range: 1; Damage: 10)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Gliding Archer
Health: 25
Speed: 3 (Flying)
Attacks: Crossbow (Range: 2; Damage 13) Crossbow 2 (Range: 3; Damage: 13)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: None
Wood Golem
Health: 30
Speed: 2
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 14)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Dorgon Golem
Health: 30
Speed: 1
Attacks: Laser Blast (Range: 1-11; Damage: 12), Burst Shot (Range: 1-3 horizontal, 2 Spaces; Damage: 14)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
[/spoiler]
Quote from: Zackirus on October 09, 2010, 06:08:14 PM
Mike: I was thinking a Regular Helenite Solider could have the stats of (Hard):
Health: 30
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 12)
Counter Attack: Melee (Range 1; Damage 12)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
While maybe a Regular Helenite Medic might have:
Health: 40
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Shield (Range: 1; Heals: 12)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
So the Combat Medic's Health is a an average of the the two: 35
[spoiler]On a side note: I think that the Helenite Units (All of Them) need a revamp so they are around the same level
Helenite Solider
Health: 30
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 12)
Counter Attack: Melee (Range 1; Damage 12)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
Helenite Medic
Health: 40
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1; Damage 6), Mind Shield (Range: 1; Heals: 12)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
Helenite Captain
Health: 50
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 15), Whirlwind (Range: Omnidirectional; Damage: 13)
Counter Attack: Melee (Range: 1; Damage 15)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
Helenite Combat-Medic
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage 10) Mind Shield (Range: 1; Heals: 10)
Counter-Attack: (Range: 1; Damage: 10)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Gliding Archer
Health: 25
Speed: 3 (Flying)
Attacks: Crossbow (Range: 2; Damage 13) Crossbow 2 (Range: 3; Damage: 13)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: None
Wood Golem
Health: 30
Speed: 2
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 14)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Dorgon Golem
Health: 30
Speed: 1
Attacks: Laser Blast (Range: 1-11; Damage: 12), Burst Shot (Range: 1-3 horizontal, 2 Spaces; Damage: 14)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
[/spoiler]
Well, I think that, instead of Mind Shield, the Helenite Medic should have something like "Patch Up," which I believe was a suggested attack for the Mechanic Medic, as they are mostly mercenaries, just like the Mechanics, and shouldn't have as many Psys on their side. Dorgon in TRPG2 had a melee attack, and since the supported Dorgon Golem of TSoG is based on Dorgon, he should have a melee attack as well. I think the Wood Golem should have 28 health instead of 30, as it should be a tad bit weaker than the Energy Golem and also weaker than the Dorgon Golem, as it is made out of wood, and shouldn't do more damage than the Stone Golem (9), because it is, again, made of wood. The Combat-Medic should do 8 damage, as a Medic of any sort being stronger than a Stone Golem is pretty silly. With a few tweaks here and there, this would make a pretty convincing Helenite force, but that's just my opinion, I'm sure someone *Cough*im2smart4u*Cough* will have a different side on this.
I agree with Duskling 110%.
I concur, however, I think the Helenites need another golem? Anyone have any ideas for one?
Yeah, maybe an arrow golem, it shoots arrows which have a range of two in all directions maybe.
On the note of the war engine, they don't have that sort of technology in the telepath universe, 5 is way too fast
And about my traps, is the way I put their damage how everyone else imagined them?
Fire Golem- Chunks of flammable stone passing through a contained internal fire inside a golem which then alight and are launched at a high speed through a chute in the direction of the enemy, hitting at range 2, effectively giving said golem fire blast. The golem is also equipped with a flame thrower to give it fire breath.
Fire Golem-(Insert Faction Here)
Speed-1 (due to the amount of stone inside it)
Health-30
Attacks-Fire Blast (range 2, damage 7); Fire Breath (range 1-2, damage 6)
[spoiler=A Side Note]I was also wondering if this one could be limited by Psi Points due to the fact that the golem can only carry so much stone.[/spoiler]
And Nameless, I'm sorry but I'm getting tired of seeing the traps every time I blink. It may just be sleep deprivation but I really hate the idea right now. Maybe they should be on hold for the next game or something.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 09, 2010, 10:38:37 PM
Fire Golem- Chunks of flammable stone passing through a contained internal fire inside a golem which then alight and are launched at a high speed through a chute in the direction of the enemy, hitting at range 2, effectively giving said golem fire blast. The golem is also equipped with a flame thrower to give it fire breath.
Fire Golem-(Insert Faction Here)
Speed-1 (due to the amount of stone inside it)
Health-30
Attacks-Fire Blast (range 2, damage 7); Fire Breath (range 1-2, damage 6)
Why do you try to make things so complicated? Keep it simple. Just have a Stone Golem (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Stone_Golem) with a flame thrower attachment (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Flame_Thrower_Attachment).
Flame Golem- Some stone golems have been updated with powerful flame throwers.
Health: 34
Speed: 1
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 9) Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 6)
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 10, 2010, 12:41:26 AM
Why do you try to make things so complicated? Keep it simple. Just have a Stone Golem (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Stone_Golem) with a flame thrower attachment (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Flame_Thrower_Attachment).
Flame Golem- Some stone golems have been updated with powerful flame throwers.
Health: 34
Speed: 1
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 9) Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 6)
I support this idea, simple, makes sense, done.
Quote from: Duskling on October 09, 2010, 09:16:56 PM
Quote from: Zackirus on October 09, 2010, 06:08:14 PM
Mike: I was thinking a Regular Helenite Solider could have the stats of (Hard):
Health: 30
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 12)
Counter Attack: Melee (Range 1; Damage 12)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
While maybe a Regular Helenite Medic might have:
Health: 40
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Shield (Range: 1; Heals: 12)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
So the Combat Medic's Health is a an average of the the two: 35
[spoiler]On a side note: I think that the Helenite Units (All of Them) need a revamp so they are around the same level
Helenite Solider
Health: 30
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 12)
Counter Attack: Melee (Range 1; Damage 12)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
Helenite Medic
Health: 40
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1; Damage 6), Mind Shield (Range: 1; Heals: 12)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
Helenite Captain
Health: 50
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 15), Whirlwind (Range: Omnidirectional; Damage: 13)
Counter Attack: Melee (Range: 1; Damage 15)
Resistance: none
Immunity: none
Helenite Combat-Medic
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage 10) Mind Shield (Range: 1; Heals: 10)
Counter-Attack: (Range: 1; Damage: 10)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Gliding Archer
Health: 25
Speed: 3 (Flying)
Attacks: Crossbow (Range: 2; Damage 13) Crossbow 2 (Range: 3; Damage: 13)
Resistance: Light
Immunity: None
Wood Golem
Health: 30
Speed: 2
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 14)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Dorgon Golem
Health: 30
Speed: 1
Attacks: Laser Blast (Range: 1-11; Damage: 12), Burst Shot (Range: 1-3 horizontal, 2 Spaces; Damage: 14)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
[/spoiler]
Well, I think that, instead of Mind Shield, the Helenite Medic should have something like "Patch Up," which I believe was a suggested attack for the Mechanic Medic, as they are mostly mercenaries, just like the Mechanics, and shouldn't have as many Psys on their side. Dorgon in TRPG2 had a melee attack, and since the supported Dorgon Golem of TSoG is based on Dorgon, he should have a melee attack as well. I think the Wood Golem should have 28 health instead of 30, as it should be a tad bit weaker than the Energy Golem and also weaker than the Dorgon Golem, as it is made out of wood, and shouldn't do more damage than the Stone Golem (9), because it is, again, made of wood. The Combat-Medic should do 8 damage, as a Medic of any sort being stronger than a Stone Golem is pretty silly. With a few tweaks here and there, this would make a pretty convincing Helenite force, but that's just my opinion, I'm sure someone *Cough*im2smart4u*Cough* will have a different side on this.
Agreed on all counts, but I don't particularly care for the Wood Golem; it seems out of place and unreal. A golem made of wood? I don't remember the inital vote/ discussion for this unit, but I am against it. Otherwise, all is okay with me.
Quote from: Duskling on October 10, 2010, 12:48:19 AM
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 10, 2010, 12:41:26 AM
Why do you try to make things so complicated? Keep it simple. Just have a Stone Golem (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Stone_Golem) with a flame thrower attachment (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Flame_Thrower_Attachment).
Flame Golem- Some stone golems have been updated with powerful flame throwers.
Health: 34
Speed: 1
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 9) Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 6)
I support this idea, simple, makes sense, done.
I agree with Duskling here.
Nameless, you may note that
a) I recently said that it would have speed 4.
b) Even if it did have speed 5, it would never use it, much like most speed 3 units almost never use their speed 3.
c) Too advanced?? They have Golems, which humans have never been able to do, mythology aside.
I'm against the war engine completely. And I thought something could have fire blast. What about the Freezer Golem? Ice blast and frost breath with a weak melée attack. And the body of a stone golem except maybe with light blue mist around it.
Quote from: Duckling on October 10, 2010, 08:00:04 AM
...c) Too advanced?? They have Golems, which humans have never been able to do, mythology aside.
they have psys too, and guess what do you see any skyscrapers? cars? computers? no. I can say that they do not have technology so much as they have mythology.
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on October 10, 2010, 09:17:23 AM
Quote from: Duckling on October 10, 2010, 08:00:04 AM
...c) Too advanced?? They have Golems, which humans have never been able to do, mythology aside.
they have psys too, and guess what do you see any skyscrapers? cars? computers? no. I can say that they do not have technology so much as they have mythology.
I'm sensing a negative tone as to how you're saying this, let's have debates, not arguments, alright? Now, more on topic, I don't see a compromise in the War Engine's "Rust" attack, care to explain it some more?
What about the Frost Golem?
Make it like im2smart4u's Fire Golem, and that's that.
No ability to shoot ice? It would look mostly like a stone golem.
It's your idea, edit any way you like, the other post was just my general advice.
What would the flame golem look like? I'm guessing it would have a gauntlet on one hand, and have the other one for punching stuff. I don't think the golem needs to be able to shoot ice. The other hand should be for punching stuff, since punching with the gauntlet hand might damage the flame thrower. (kinda a weak argument, I know)
The maybe instead of fire blast it could have, as yogc said, a gauntlet set on fire so instead of just a melée attack it would have a fire attack. Maybe both hands could be a gauntlet. Thoughts?
That isn't exactly what I meant...
I was thinking that the gauntlet would be the flamethrower so players would be able to instantly see whether or not the golem was a stone golem or flame golem. Sorry for not being clear, but by the other one for punching stuff, I meant the other arm. The problem about having a gauntlet for melee combat is that the attack can't do both fire and physical damage. If there was a gauntlet on both arms, one should be a flame thrower and one should be something like brass knuckles. Personally, I think it only needs one gauntlet and one melee attack or two gauntlets and just a fire attack.
I do think that the golems attack should be more like fire breath than fire blast.
Quote from: yogc elf on October 10, 2010, 03:46:31 PM
What would the flame golem look like? I'm guessing it would have a gauntlet on one hand, and have the other one for punching stuff. I don't think the golem needs to be able to shoot ice. The other hand should be for punching stuff, since punching with the gauntlet hand might damage the flame thrower. (kinda a weak argument, I know)
I get what you are trying to do, but we know from Flint that the flame thrower attachment is inside the golem and shots flames from the golem's mouth. I think we should make the flame golems from different color stones(maybe basalt), then the stone used to make regular stone golems. I also don't like the idea of golems using frost blasts.
Stone Golem:
(http://s3.postimage.org/aOizS.png) (http://www.postimage.org/)
Flame Golem:
(http://s3.postimage.org/aOK0r.png) (http://www.postimage.org/)
I like the look of it and I was wondering, what if the golem were to let put and excess amount of gas from the flamethrower in a short burst, wouldn't it have a kind of fire blast?
I like the idea however, don't you think it should be stronger than a stone golem because the Helenites would have taken more time to enforce the material they used to build the golem. Also because the rock might be a bit hotter, wouldn't it do more damage?
Flame Golem
Heath: 45
Speed: 1
Attacks: Melee (Range 1; Damage: 16) Fire Breath (Range 1-2; Damage: 13)
Resistance: Pryo (well it is a fire rock)
Immunity: None
What about it having a sort of fire blast?
What do you mean by "Sort of Fire Blast"?
Well... If the flamethrower inside the golem were tonrelease an excessive amount of gas in a quick instant, wouldn't a burst or blast of flame come from it?
I see what you mean but what is the difference between attacks?
Firebreath affects 2 spaces. And Fire blast affects only one 2 spaces away.
Quote from: Zackirus on October 10, 2010, 05:56:36 PMI like the idea however, don't you think it should be stronger than a stone golem because the Helenites would have taken more time to enforce the material they used to build the golem.
Why does everyone think the Helenites are so much more powerful then the Mechanics? The only thing mentioned about the Helenites is the fact that they lost a military contract to the Mechanics.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 10, 2010, 05:51:03 PM
I like the look of it and I was wondering, what if the golem were to let put and excess amount of gas from the flamethrower in a short burst, wouldn't it have a kind of fire blast?
Flamethrowers spray a stream of fire, so we should stick with the attack that Flint had with his flame thrower attachment.
Hmm... Alright. I'll give on the fire blast and stop trying to convice people about it. Looking forward, what about a fire flash? For the flame golem.
Fire Golem
Health:38(that good?)
Speed:1
Attacks: Melée (Range 1; Damage 6) Fire Breath (Range 1-2, Damage 7) Fire Flash[Name Debatable](Range 1; Damage 9)
Any changes? Please use the format above and ITALICIZE any changes.
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 10, 2010, 12:41:26 AMWhy do you try to make things so complicated? Keep it simple. Just have a Stone Golem (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Stone_Golem) with a flame thrower attachment (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Flame_Thrower_Attachment) and a capacitor (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Capacitor).
Flame Golem- Some stone golems have been updated with powerful flame throwers.
Health: 34
Speed: 1
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 9) Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 6)
Keep it simple.
Alright. I guess I'll vote yay on that. Can I keep the tally since it was originally my idea?
Flame Golem
Yay-
Buggy
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 10, 2010, 08:25:51 PM
Quote from: Zackirus on October 10, 2010, 05:56:36 PMI like the idea however, don't you think it should be stronger than a stone golem because the Helenites would have taken more time to enforce the material they used to build the golem.
Why does everyone think the Helenites are so much more powerful then the Mechanics? The only thing mentioned about the Helenites is the fact that they lost a military contract to the Mechanics.
Well because they have(had) Helena, who was by far an more inventive upgrader (seeing as she made Flint more powerful then he was) than any regular person in the mechanics. Also, don't you think if they are going to build a fire breathing golem don't you think they would need to golem to resistant to fire and be stronger than its stone counterpart.
Quote from: Zackirus on October 10, 2010, 09:06:25 PM
Well because they have(had) Helena, who was by far an more inventive upgrader (seeing as she made Flint more powerful then he was) than any regular person in the mechanics. Also, don't you think if they are going to build a fire breathing golem don't you think they would need to golem to resistant to fire and be stronger than its stone counterpart.
A)Both Helena and Flint were Mechanics during the Shadow War.
B)She upgraded Flint with Mechanic parts, so that means that the Mechanics already built Steam Engines, Capacitors, and Flame Thrower Attachments for certain golems.
C)The Mechanics got a military contract from the Ravinale Guard, so that means that the Mechanics are better or equal to the Helenites.
The Flame Golem would have the same strength and health as a Stone Golem, because the Flame Golem is a Stone Golem with an attachment.
Think of the Stone Golem as M4 Sherman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M4_Sherman_variants) tank. Even if you add a flame thrower (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flame_tank#Medium_Tank_M4_.28General_Sherman.29), bulldozer blade (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combat_engineering_vehicle#M4_Sherman), or rocket launcher (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T34_Calliope) to the M1 Sherman, it will still be a M1 Sherman.
If you add a Steam Engine, Capacitor, Spin Saw, or Flame Thrower to a Stone Golem, then you still have a Stone Golem.
That's why the Flame Golem should have a uniqueish attack to separate it from Flint. I vote fire fist.
I second that. +yay
By the way buggy, where'd your mirror troops go? Or did you abandon that idea already?
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 10, 2010, 10:32:08 PM
B)She upgraded Flint with Mechanic parts, so that means that the Mechanics already built Steam Engines, Capacitors, and Flame Thrower Attachments for certain golems.
I'd say the Helenites are equal to or better than the Mechanics, as Helena was a Mechanic, so she knows some/most/maybe all of their techniques and whatnot, and the Ravinale guard member who hired the Mechanics said he regretted it and should have hired the Helenites.
@ Duskling 2 pages ago
When talking of Stone Golems, or talking near them, or in the case of Bronze Golems, you hear stone grinding, or bronze parts spinning inside. As you can see from the Golem Workshop in TRPG2, these are very complicated. It's not very clearly defined what a War Engine is, and until someone can find a legitimate source on what a war engine is, it's open to interpretation. It wouldn't have to be put together well, and it's obvious this isn't an optimal design of the War Engine, as it rusts every turn, so the technology is about the same level as Golems. The rusting is due a lack of oil on the battlefield, and disuse of the attack machinery on any given turn. I didn't want the enemy to have to be placed anywhere in particular for it to work, but as there has been intense pressure for the vestigial speed 5 (I keep insisting that it wouldn't be used as actual speed, but merely a way to keep speed up at 4 for a turn, and thus wouldn't violate the NO SPEED 5 rule, because speed 5 motions are what causes programming problems), I changed the speed to 4, giving it a distance of 10 before stopping if no players are encountered by the enemy.
Quote from: Duskling on October 10, 2010, 11:06:15 PM
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 10, 2010, 10:32:08 PM
C)The Mechanics got a military contract from the Ravinale Guard, so that means that the Mechanics are better or equal to the Helenites.
I'd say the Helenites are equal to or better than the Mechanics, as Helena was a Mechanic, so she knows some/most/maybe all of their techniques and whatnot, and the Ravinale guard member who hired the Mechanics said he regretted it and should have hired the Helenites.
Agreed. Also, Helena was already at that level after they just left the Mechanics. She didn't even belong to any proper group. Now she's the boss of the Helenites so it should make them better than the Mechanics.
Quote from: Duckling on October 10, 2010, 11:32:48 PM
@ Duskling 2 pages ago
When talking of Stone Golems, or talking near them, or in the case of Bronze Golems, you hear stone grinding, or bronze parts spinning inside. As you can see from the Golem Workshop in TRPG2, these are very complicated. It's not very clearly defined what a War Engine is, and until someone can find a legitimate source on what a war engine is, it's open to interpretation. It wouldn't have to be put together well, and it's obvious this isn't an optimal design of the War Engine, as it rusts every turn, so the technology is about the same level as Golems. The rusting is due a lack of oil on the battlefield, and disuse of the attack machinery on any given turn. I didn't want the enemy to have to be placed anywhere in particular for it to work, but as there has been intense pressure for the vestigial speed 5 (I keep insisting that it wouldn't be used as actual speed, but merely a way to keep speed up at 4 for a turn, and thus wouldn't violate the NO SPEED 5 rule, because speed 5 motions are what causes programming problems), I changed the speed to 4, giving it a distance of 10 before stopping if no players are encountered by the enemy.
In that case, define "War Engine" since it was your idea to begin with. Regarding its speed, if the war engine really is in its developing stage then it shouldn't even be this fast.
Golems are powerful, right? But they rely on that power to hit things. The War engine has no need of power in its movements, so it can use the same raw energy on speed, thus making it slightly faster than a human; speed 4. Its attacks lie separate of its movements.
Anyway, I wish to leave it open to interpretation so it could be flexibly implemented.
Quote from: Duckling on October 10, 2010, 11:59:29 PM
Golems are powerful, right? But they rely on that power to hit things. The War engine has no need of power in its movements, so it can use the same raw energy on speed, thus making it slightly faster than a human; speed 4. Its attacks lie separate of its movements.
Anyway, I wish to leave it open to interpretation so it could be flexibly implemented.
No one would really bother defining it if it's not their idea, unless they really love it. No offense, but people don't seem to like your idea to that extent. As for the speed I really don't care, but shouldn't war machines be more powerful than they are fast? Of course it's open to interpretation, but it would be better if you defined it yourself, then we would help expand on that. Take the traps and fire golems for example, if you have been following.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 10, 2010, 10:39:41 PM
That's why the Flame Golem should have a uniqueish attack to separate it from Flint. I vote fire fist.
Why would we want to separate the Flame Golem from Flint when we are basing the golem off of Flint?
Quote from: Duskling on October 10, 2010, 11:06:15 PM
the Ravinale guard member who hired the Mechanics said he regretted it and should have hired the Helenites.
That was because they let Resistance soldiers into the camp. If they hired Helenites and the Resistance got into the camp, then they would regret not hiring the Mechanics.
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 11, 2010, 12:16:30 AM
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 10, 2010, 10:39:41 PM
That's why the Flame Golem should have a uniqueish attack to separate it from Flint. I vote fire fist.
Why would we want to separate the Flame Golem from Flint when we are basing the golem off of Flint?
Quote from: Duskling on October 10, 2010, 11:06:15 PM
the Ravinale guard member who hired the Mechanics said he regretted it and should have hired the Helenites.
That was because they let Resistance soldiers into the camp. If they hired Helenites and the Resistance got into the camp, then they would regret not hiring the Mechanics.
That is true. But of course the Ravinale guards don't know better since they were the next to be slaughtered. We want to make the Flame Golem unique because Flint was from the Mechanics. The Helenites are their own group. Even then, Helena was quite proud of Flint too, so it would make sense that some of its features would be based off Flint's.
What are you going to do with a War Engine that's powerful? Run people over? I'm afraid that's too dificult to program. Since the ability to get places fast is an advantage, a designer would go with speed, not strength. Anyway, what I was saying was not that it needed forther definition, but that the explanation I gave on what a War Engine was like did not conflict with the current one for the sole reason that there is no formal definiton of a War Engine, just an idea, and the idea can take a couple of different forms. Details, details; if you want to ask more about the War Engine, first ask exactly how tall in centimeters a Stone Golem is. Then I'll gladly pay you back Tuesday... I mean provide information.
Quote from: Duckling on October 11, 2010, 12:38:14 AM
What are you going to do with a War Engine that's powerful? Run people over? I'm afraid that's too dificult to program. Since the ability to get places fast is an advantage, a designer would go with speed, not strength. Anyway, what I was saying was not that it needed forther definition, but that the explanation I gave on what a War Engine was like did not conflict with the current one for the sole reason that there is no formal definiton of a War Engine, just an idea, and the idea can take a couple of different forms. Details, details; if you want to ask more about the War Engine, first ask exactly how tall in centimeters a Stone Golem is. Then I'll gladly pay you back Tuesday... I mean provide information.
I was saying, if you had bothered to define its stats in the beginning, you would have wasted less time in arguing about your idea. I'm pretty sure if you had followed the ideas on traps then you would have noticed that you lacked something. Actually, just notice every single idea that got yays and nays. They all had stats defined by the person
before he/she modified them.
I already gave the stats. I'll go fish them out, but if you can't be bothered to find them, and I'm assuming you didn't join in the discussion late, don't say I didn't give the stats.
Quote from: Duckling on October 05, 2010, 06:17:11 PM
What if we had a VERY fast enemy (5, per se?) that, if on any given turn, didn't attack, it would use a default attack which lowered its speed by 1?
It would be a very "use it or lose it" sort of thing. Eventually, it would become a turret enemy like Energy Golems, which is why I suggest it be a War Engine (it rusts if you don't use it), and have a range of 2-4 in any of the 4 directions. Thus:
War Engine
HP: 50
PsP: N/A
Speed: 5 (to start with)
Attacks: Projectile (14 physical damage), Rust (Default: reduces own speed by 1)
Resistance to Heat (steam engine: heat only helps it burn hotter; it's a compromise between structural damage and better working. Instead of upping the damage done by 4 for every Heat attack sent its way [althrough that would be cool], it instead just gets a 50% damage reduction. Possibly used by the mechanics. Then again, they already have their golem tank units, so maybe this can be more of a Helenite thing.
Okay, Chrono?
Oh well, can't argue with that now. My fault for not checking again. Still, I don't know why you want your idea in so badly. That doesn't mean I don't like the idea. I actually do, but clearly others don't. I could do with speed of 4, so ask the other voters again.
My point; abstract isn't what ya got, or so I thought.
And doesn't anyone want their idea in? But, as the overwhelming majority has an unbased prejudice against it, the idea goes onto the cutting room floor. Except it was never in anything to cut it out of.
Quote from: Duckling on October 11, 2010, 01:16:40 AM
My point; abstract isn't what ya got, or so I thought.
And doesn't anyone want their idea in? But, as the overwhelming majority has an unbased prejudice against it, the idea goes onto the cutting room floor. Except it was never in anything to cut it out of.
Sorry, removed the abstract part. It was a bad thing to say. And yeah, we do want our ideas in, but I would accept it anyway even if my idea was flatly rejected. Just come up with a better one, I'm pretty sure you can. Don't ask me why I suddenly changed my tone, I was never asking for an argument in the first place. Maybe I got caught up halfway, but that wasn't what I intended.
Quote from: Duckling on October 05, 2010, 06:17:11 PM
War Engine
HP: 50
Speed: 5 (to start with)
Attacks: Projectile (14 physical damage), Rust (Default: reduces own speed by 1)
Resistance to Heat (steam engine: heat only helps it burn hotter; it's a compromise between structural damage and better working. Instead of upping the damage done by 4 for every Heat attack sent its way [althrough that would be cool], it instead just gets a 50% damage reduction. Possibly used by the mechanics. Then again, they already have their golem tank units, so maybe this can be more of a Helenite thing.
The War Engine idea is so bad that I didn't find it worth discussing, so I continued to ignore it and addressed better ideas.
Since you continue to bring it up despite it's unpopularity, I will have to try to shoot it down.
A) The name "War Engine" is uncreative and could describe anything.
B) For the thousandth time, NO SPEEDS GREATER THEN FOUR!
C) What is the challenge of an enemy that gradually becomes more harmless?
D) Why would the engine turn to rust at supper speeds? I live in one hundred percent humidity and it still takes hours for signs of rust to show up on any metal, yet your war engine is rusting at a baffling rate in the desert.
E) If you know anything about engines, then you would know that they are vulnerable to overheating. Adding heat to an engine would not make it more effective, but would likely make it break.
F) This type of technology doesn't fit within the Telepath world. Golems seem like sentient beings, while your war engine idea seem like a lifeless, mindless machine.
G) Projectile? That could be anything that flies through the air.
War Engine:
NAY!
He did alter the speed to 4, but forgot to change it when he reposted. But yes, your points are convincing enough. Just try something else, Duckling. im2smart4u, you don't have to be this discouraging, even though you made a lot of sense. So just list the points in a more neutral tone. I know you're unhappy with the fact that he made it start with speed 5, but you don't have to go that far, especially since he did give in on the speeds.
Woah, my head is spinning from all the multiple conversations going on but here goes.
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 11, 2010, 12:16:30 AM
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 10, 2010, 10:39:41 PM
That's why the Flame Golem should have a uniqueish attack to separate it from Flint. I vote fire fist.
Why would we want to separate the Flame Golem from Flint when we are basing the golem off of Flint?
Quote from: Duskling on October 10, 2010, 11:06:15 PM
the Ravinale guard member who hired the Mechanics said he regretted it and should have hired the Helenites.
That was because they let Resistance soldiers into the camp. If they hired Helenites and the Resistance got into the camp, then they would regret not hiring the Mechanics.
The point is not to base the flame golem off of Flint. It was to create an advanced golem. If we just give it a flamethrower, we might as well give it a spin saw, psi capacitor, and a steam engine and call it Flint. It needs an attack to sepaerate it. Hence:
Bean Burrito-All that extra gas has to go somewhere.
Flame Golem
Range:-1 & -2
Type:Fire (well it's hot ain't it?)
Damage:(you decide)
im2smart4u: Let me address the points one by one:
- The reason I named it thusly is that it fits the idea I have in mind so aptly. How about "Mobile Cannon", or "Siege Ballista"?
- For the thousandth time: YOU'RE BEING PREJUDICED, AND NOT EVEN CONSIDERING THE FACT THAT IT WOULDN'T USE THE 5 EVEN IF IT HAD IT, AND THAT I GOT RID OF IT!
- The enemy doesn't become any less harmless. Only less mobile, and if you choose to avoid the enemy until he runs out of motion, that could take some effort (some challenge in and of itself), and still the enemy has good damage and a decent range (which, I might add, makes it all the harder to avoid him whilst he still moves)
- If you don't like rust, maybe you can work with some degree of instability, leading the thing to fall apart. Like the Dorgon, it might be a test model.
- I know enough about engines to know that a little heat doesn't hurt, but help, aiding the [insert organic matter here] burning. Fire attacks could also overheat the boiler, and warp the metal; I acknowledge this, and having done a bit more research, I revoke the Heat Resistance that, I even thought was iffy
- We've established through the discussion of other enemies that they've come up with the wheel already, so we can safely assume they have carts. Then, the engine. If they have Golems with Flamethrowers, Capacitors that can store raw Psy Energy, and wait a sec... what is it that makes him go faster...? Oh, right: A STEAM ENGINE!
- You don't like Projectile? Try "Slug."
The mechanics are good at lifeless machines, too. Energy golems don't seem to have much sentience, and Dorgon just had the capacity to use available info to make an answer. Sounds pretty lifeless to me. And it said in-game in TRPG2 that Flint was the first Stone Golem to really show emotion.
War Engine vote
Nay:
Bugfartboy
im2smart4u
Zackirus
Yay:
Duckling
War Engine: Nay
Is everyone in agreeance with the:
Helenite Combat-Medic
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 9) Patch Up/Mind Shield (Range: 1; Heals: 9)
Counter Attack: Melee (Range: 1; Damage 9)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Quote from: Zackirus on October 11, 2010, 01:38:16 PM
Helenite Combat-Medic
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 9) Patch Up/Mind Shield (Range: 1; Heals: 9)
Counter Attack: Melee (Range: 1; Damage 9)
*Why does every new enemy have a counter-attack? This game is going to be really lame if you can't attack anyone from the front.
*Most healers can heal more than they can damage.
*Even if you make those changes, I am going to abstain from voting. We have already spent alot of time discussing enemies like the Greater Ghost or the Elite Spearman, but those suggestions were quickly ignored, because Craig already planned on creating those soldiers before we even suggested it. I am sure that Criag already created or at least thought of the stats he is going to use for all Helenite soldiers, so it would be pointless to discuss this enemy.
This unit deals the same amount of damage as it heals because it was trained so that its healing and combat were on par. However, in doing so its overall abilites were decreased. With the counter attack- I can see now why some poeple may not like it so it can be removed.
Okay, it's obvious no one likes the idea. If anyone has a reason, I'd like to know so I don't make the same mistakes when suggesting another idea.
it's way too fast for what it is, the whole thing just seems to me to be... just... you know, it doesn't really fit.
No, I don't know -- and some schmo on a bike can go faster than most people running, and can keep it up longer. Same thing for the Siege Ballista, except it uses a steam engine. It's not too fast.
And a supersized (supersizing seems to be a theme; we have supersized bugs, supersized sentient bats, supersized scorpions) crossbow on wheels fits, in my perception.
What'd does anyone think of the special attack for the Flame Golem to give it some diversity?
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 11, 2010, 07:25:49 AM
Woah, my head is spinning from all the multiple conversations going on but here goes.Quote from: im2smart4u on October 11, 2010, 12:16:30 AM
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 10, 2010, 10:39:41 PM
That's why the Flame Golem should have a uniqueish attack to separate it from Flint. I vote fire fist.
Why would we want to separate the Flame Golem from Flint when we are basing the golem off of Flint?
Quote from: Duskling on October 10, 2010, 11:06:15 PM
the Ravinale guard member who hired the Mechanics said he regretted it and should have hired the Helenites.
That was because they let Resistance soldiers into the camp. If they hired Helenites and the Resistance got into the camp, then they would regret not hiring the Mechanics.
The point is not to base the flame golem off of Flint. It was to create an advanced golem. If we just give it a flamethrower, we might as well give it a spin saw, psi capacitor, and a steam engine and call it Flint. It needs an attack to sepaerate it. Hence:
Bean Burrito-All that extra gas has to go somewhere.
Flame Golem
Range:-1 & -2
Type:Fire (well it's hot ain't it?)
Damage:(you decide)
Quote from: Zackirus on October 11, 2010, 01:38:16 PM
Helenite Combat-Medic
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 9) Patch Up/Mind Shield (Range: 1; Heals: 9)
Quote from: Zackirus on October 11, 2010, 02:02:25 PM
This unit deals the same amount of damage as it heals because it was trained so that its healing and combat were on par. However, in doing so its overall abilites were decreased. With the counter attack- I can see now why some poeple may not like it so it can be removed.
Yay. I said I would abstain from voting, but your enemy idea seems well thought out and versatile, so formulating it couldn't hurt. I also like how you kept it simple unlike some people's outlandish ideas that don't fit well in the Telepath world.
Are you ignoring the Flame Golem attack because you hate it?
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 11, 2010, 04:57:56 PM
Are you ignoring the Flame Golem attack because you hate it?
I don't see why we would give him another attack when we already know that it is canon for a golem to be given a flame thrower attachment, so that the golem can use Fire Breath.
Plus, how do you expect anyone to take "Bean Burrito" serious?
Nay on the cheesey bean burrito, and yay to the Combat Medic (like Veradux?).
I was only joking on the name. I was thinking on something like Exaust Fumes.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 11, 2010, 06:06:55 PM
I was only joking on the name. I was thinking on something like Exaust Fumes.
How about Fire Burst? Sounds more damaging than Exhaust Fumes.
It's got a range of 1-2 behind the Flame Golem.
Quote from: Chrono on October 11, 2010, 06:10:32 PM
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 11, 2010, 06:06:55 PM
I was only joking on the name. I was thinking on something like Exaust Fumes.
How about Fire Burst? Sounds more damaging than Exhaust Fumes.
How about we call the attack Fire Breath, but instead it coming from the Golem's behind, it will come from the Golem's mouth?
New enemy idea:
Vengeful Ghost
HP: 50
PsP: N/A
Speed: 3
Attacks:
- Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 18)
- Feedback (Range: 2, Damage: 20)
- Vengeance (Range: 1-3, Damage: 16)
Resistance: Physical
Deadlier than the Greater Ghost, it lacks the immunity against physical attacks and might be introduced along with or later than the Greater Ghost in higher level crypts.
Comments, anyone?
I think we should finish the voting for or against the Helenite and Flame Golem before we move onto new enemies.
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 11, 2010, 06:38:50 PM
I think we should finish the voting for or against the Helenite and Flame Golem before we move onto new enemies.
Agreed. We don't want to get too many things going at once. What are the ideas on the Firey Fart/Exaust Fumes/Bean Burrito?
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 11, 2010, 06:49:42 PM
What are the ideas on the Firey Fart/Exaust Fumes/Bean Burrito?
There is not going to be any enemy that farts flames. Try to think of more mature things.
Votes:
Yay for Helenite Combat Medic, I don't really care about the melee counter.
Maybe for the Flame Golem. I do like the Fire Punch (whatever it's called now) but I have no good comments on said Fiery Fart. It's not likely that the enemy AI would use it anyway because they just love facing you for some reason, unless it comes as a sort of an add-on to Fire Breath. Or it could be from its sides rather than behind.
I agree with im2smart4u, the golem is fine with only the fire breath add-on.
Note: The Helenite Comabt Medic will be added to the forumulated because it has gotten 8 Yays (also 9 if you count Cypher which he said 'I will change it to Yay if you change its name").
It wasn't a firey type. It was a heat type. Really hot gas released backwards. I'm not being serious enough for it to be given some thought.
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 10, 2010, 12:41:26 AMWhy do you try to make things so complicated? Keep it simple. Just have a Stone Golem (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Stone_Golem) with a flame thrower attachment (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Flame_Thrower_Attachment) and a capacitor (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Capacitor).
Flame Golem- Some stone golems have been updated with powerful flame throwers.
Health: 34
Speed: 1
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 9) Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 6)
Time to vote. Yay or Nay?
Yay:
im2smart4u
Duskling
MikeW781
Cypher
Duckling
Zackirus
The Holy namelesskitty
Nay:
Bugfartboy
Maybe:
Chrono
I vote yay.
I vote nay on the simple version by im2smart4u. How is it any different from the way Flint was besides being inferior?
Point taken, but do you have anything else besides Fiery Fart / Exhaust Fumes?
I already suggested it having pyro blast but it was shot down. Oooo... What about a kind of Pryo Hail but at a longer range? It could be "Gernade", "Explosion", or "Pyro Flash". It would have a rand three and have a form like pyro hail in a + shape.
Pyro Cross? ;D
Pyro hail already exists and it's the fire area attack. But I like the name, though it may cause confusion for some between it and pyro hail.
I was thinking kind of a fiery version of Cryo Cross. Then again there's no way it should be related to psy attacks since it's a golem. Also people don't like the idea of having a complicated Flame Golem.
WOW! Really? I havn't noticed But what do you think about the range 3 + shaped fire attack?
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 11, 2010, 09:39:24 PM
WOW! Really? I havn't noticed But what do you think about the range 3 + shaped fire attack?
Um. You mean, like the way Light Bomb is different from Dark Vortex?
EDIT: I don't mind having that. By the way this really should go under the New Attack Ideas...
It's new teammate attack ideas and this is still on topic. It's for the flame golem.
Well yes, but after we finish discussing about this you should go post your idea of said altered Pyro Hail on the new teammates attack ideas. And, you still haven't told me what you really meant...
Alright. How heavy is a gernade? Now imagine you had inhuman strength. Then imagine throwing said grenade. How far do you think it would go?
OK then. Didn't pay attention to the "grenade" when you first mentioned it. I vote yay for "grenade"/"Pyro Cross" whichever attack you prefer. Both sound good to me. We need a better name for Pyro Cross because it sounds like a psy attack though.
Explosive Throw? That sound right? What about just Gernade? Any other name ideas?
By Pyro Cross I meant the Pyro version of the Cryo Cross. As for your idea, Grenade doesn't sound right now that I think about it. The enemy is a Flame Golem, not a Military Golem. Explosive Throw / Flame Toss work better methinks. Also on a side note, this shouldn't really belong to new teammate attack ideas now that I think about it.
I am against the huge range. You suggest that having inhuman strength will allow you to move one's arm faster. But you are one of the people who said that my Siege Ballista was too fast, but the fact is, both are made by mechanics, and I would say if one can't be fast, the other can't be fast.
Oh, you finally named it something appropriate :-[ by the way, your Siege Ballista itself was already moving fast with a speed of "4", technically 3. But the Flame Golem still moves with a speed of 1. And both have ranged attacks. So I don't think it is unfair in any way, comparing it with your Siege Ballista.
No, but a couple of posts back (say, 10?) Buggy was saying that it would have an awesome throwing distance due to its inhuman strength, and all I'm saying it that if inhuman strength and power turns into high speed in throwing for him, by Jupiter, it should allow a siege ballista to go quickly, too. So it isn't "too fast". Sorry to kind of necropost that idea.
Attached is what it would have looked like, for those of you for whom imagination does not suffice.
If you don't like the idea of having ranged attacks that much, then my "Pyro Cross" (I really need to give it another name) or any downsized version of it should work. But as you can see, Buggy's idea isn't getting much support either.
EDIT: By the way, he kind of exaggerated the point. He did mention a space of 3, where the epicenter is, but as I already said, throwing grenades make the Flame Golem behave more like a Military Golem, which wouldn't make much sense. In any case, I did rename the attack for "grenade".
EDIT2: If you still don't like what I just said, then go for a similar but smaller version of Cryo Cross, as I mentioned on the top of this post.
Okay, I think I'll pretend not to be confuzzled right now...
I'm just kind of against the grenades, 'cause the mechanics seem to be at about mid-19th c tech-wise. Modern-day grenades require C4.
Which is what I said, so scratch grenades and pretend we were talking about throwing, say, a fireball or something. Which is still what I said:
Quote from: Chrono on October 11, 2010, 10:12:27 PM
As for your idea, Grenade doesn't sound right now that I think about it. The enemy is a Flame Golem, not a Military Golem. Explosive Throw / Flame Toss work better methinks.
Grats on making Blue Cape by the way.
What is the Golem throwing, exactly? Golems don't have Psy powers... unless a powerful Heat Psy charged their capacitor with Heat Psy force, and made the right adjustments-- so they couldn't be throwing pure fire, 'cause the Mechanics and Helenites are a mercenary group, and have few to no Psys in their ranks.
Are they throwing pitch? Wood? Hot rocks?
Ask Buggy on that, but I'm assuming it has to do with the Flame Golem's Fire Breath.
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 11, 2010, 08:22:12 PM
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 10, 2010, 12:41:26 AMWhy do you try to make things so complicated? Keep it simple. Just have a Stone Golem (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Stone_Golem) with a flame thrower attachment (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Flame_Thrower_Attachment) and a capacitor (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Capacitor).
Flame Golem- Some stone golems have been updated with powerful flame throwers.
Health: 34
Speed: 1
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 9) Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 6)
Time to vote. Yay or Nay?
Yay:
im2smart4u
Duskling
MikeW781
Chrono
Nay:
Bugfartboy (because he wants add a fire fart)
Any more votes?
yay, sounds good to me
On the topic of the "Gernade", it's not really a modern day Gernade. It's an old type of Gernade. Practically anything explosive is what it throws. If they have steam engines by now shouldn't they have discovered dynamite or another kind of explosive substance? And im2smart4u, the "Fire Fart" is not what is being discussed so stop being a *female mother dog* and try to consider new ideas. And Duckling, the explosive wouldn't be that heavy, so it COULD throw an inhuman distance, but the weight of the Flame Golem would keep it slow. And the Gernade would be very weak to have such a big range. Though, I see a lot of you discrediting it just because of the range. I guess we better talk to Craig about shortening Light Bombs range too then huh?
It's "Grenade". Please get it right; it's bothering me.
And who said anything about explosives? The only explosives I've seen in TRPG are Psy-related. Until we have evidence, analogous or otherwise, (like, they're blast-mining) I'd prefer not to make the assumption that they have explosives, as it might be a major story point later.
I'm yay for the Flame Golem (Simple Version)
Yay for simple version. I still don't get why Buggy version has stuff that it's throwing. Where does it keep its ammo?
Yay for fire golem.
Which one? Mine with another, more unique attack, or im2smart4u's?
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 11, 2010, 08:22:12 PMQuote from: im2smart4u on October 10, 2010, 12:41:26 AMWhy do you try to make things so complicated? Keep it simple. Just have a Stone Golem (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Stone_Golem) with a flame thrower attachment (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Flame_Thrower_Attachment) and a capacitor (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Capacitor).
Flame Golem- Some stone golems have been updated with powerful flame throwers.
Health: 34
Speed: 1
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 9) Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 6)
Time to vote. Yay or Nay?
Yay:
im2smart4u
Duskling
MikeW781
Chrono
Cypher
Duckling
Zackirus
The Holy namelesskitty
Nay:
Bugfartboy
With 8 yays and only 1 nay, there are enough votes to formulate (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=27.0) the Flame Golem.
How do you know that all of the yays were for yours? And I'm mad that you didn't even give me credit for coming up with the original idea.
Hold it im2smart4u, I only voted yay when Buggy wanted "fire fart". Sorry for not telling you earlier, but if it's not too late, please put me on the maybe side.
It's not. Sure he's already put it in "Formulated Enemy Ideas":
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 12, 2010, 08:38:48 PM
To make a Stone Golem more lethal, a flame thrower attachment (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Flame_Thrower_Attachment) and a capacitor (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Capacitor) could be installed.
Flame Golem
Health: 34
Speed: 1
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 9) Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 6)
But that doesn't mean that it can't be deleted and or modified. And I don't think Cypher said what he was specifically voting for.
Thing is, I don't know if he's willing to do that...
He's not. He can be really stubborn. But what about the channeler golem. A golem that is being controlled by a Psi to act as that Psi's "Avatar". It would have a weak mind blast and such and maybe an equally weak feedback but it would have low mobility and highish health. And it would only be seen when the Mercenaries are working for a Psi enabled group, seeing as the Mechanics themselves are not much for Psis.
Wait, this means that the golems just became weaker :o
EDIT: Just to be sure, I need to see the attack/stats.
Yeah. Bad idea. How often would that even happen? Maybe im2smart4u's golem could be a normal flame golem but there could be Pyro Golems with the grenades, flamethrower, and exaust attack as well as a weaker melée attack.
If you're still working on that, how about my old idea?
Vengeful Ghost
HP:
50 45
PsP: N/A
Speed:
3 2
Attacks
- Mind Blast (Damage: 18, Range: 1)
- Feedback (Damage: 20, Range: 2)
- Vengeance (Damage: 16, Range: 1-3)
Resistance: Physical
More lethal and durable than the Greater Ghost, the Vengeful Ghost could come in higher level crypts, and/or in later missions.
All ghosts have Physical Resistance. Just comes with the territory. But drop the speed down to 2 and the health to 45, and you'll have a yay from me. Maybe really.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 12, 2010, 11:09:47 PM
All ghosts have Physical Resistance. Just comes with the territory. But drop the speed down to 2 and the health to 45, and you'll have a yay from me. Maybe really.
Whoops, forgot to add it in. I did do it the first time though.
I just mentioned the resistance because I thought that originally you had planned on removing it.
No, I don't know what went wrong with me. Naturally I wouldn't exclude physical resistance if it were a ghost.
Alright. What about a golem designed for domestic use such as keeping food cold. A golem with a Cold infused capacitor with the duty of aiding in the camps of the Helenites/Mechanics. It could be given an order to attack and have frost breath and Ice Blast.
That was... unexpected. But what does the Ice Blast have anything to do with golems? Ice Blast is supposed to be a psy attack.
EDIT: By the way Buggy, I did some research and it turns out that there are much stronger enemies than my suggested Vengeful Ghost:
Quote from: KZ on February 05, 2010, 07:42:43 PM
White Cape (Mental)
Health: 95
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 15), Feedback (Range: 2, Damage/Healing: 22), Vengeance (Range: 1-3, Damage: 20)
Greater Ghost
Health: 65
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (range 1, damage 15), Cryo Blast (range 2, damage 15), Cryo Cross (range- omnidirectional+1, damage 12)
Resistance: physical
So, I will not change the health and speed for Vengeful Ghost for now:
Vengeful GhostHealth: 50
Speed: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 18), Feedback (Range: 2, Damage/Healing: 20), Vengeance: (Range: 1-3, Damage/Healing: 18)
Resistance: Physical
Less healthy but deadlier and more durable than the Greater Ghost, the Vengeful Ghost is difficult to take down and may be added into higher level crypts and/or later missions.
I don't see the need for a another powerful spirit. The Greater Ghost already takes the role of a powerful spirit.
It would be like suggesting a Bandit Captian when there is already a Bandit Leader (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Bandit_Leader). Even though their attacks are different, they would share the same role.
Bandit Captain: (not a real suggestion).
Health: 80
Speed: 3
Attacks: Double Strike (Range: 1, Damage: 15)
Bandit Leader:
Health: 85
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 9), Slash (Range: 1 rightward arc, Damage: 11)
Counter-attack: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 9)
OK, but others might. I'll put you on the nay..
Maybe instead of Feedback AND Vengence, it should have pyro blast seeing as it could concentrate it's anger as power. Emotions can be very powerful and dangerous.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 13, 2010, 05:32:02 PM
Maybe instead of Feedback AND Vengence, it should have pyro blast seeing as it could concentrate it's anger as power. Emotions can be very powerful and dangerous.
I think spirits are tied to Cold like Shadowlings are tied to Shadows.
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 13, 2010, 05:57:29 PM
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 13, 2010, 05:32:02 PM
Maybe instead of Feedback AND Vengence, it should have pyro blast seeing as it could concentrate it's anger as power. Emotions can be very powerful and dangerous.
I think spirits are tied to Cold like Shadowlings are tied to Shadows.
So are you for yay or nay, Buggy?
Eh. Put me as a maybe. I'd like to see a few changes but I can see that my ideas aren't wildly popular.
Ghost Healer-This spirit doesn't remember much, but he does remember how to heal.
Stats Health: 18
Steps: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 4), Mind Shield (Range: 1, Healing: 14)
Ghost Healer: Yay
I shall hold my horses.
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 13, 2010, 01:22:17 PM
I don't see the need for a another powerful spirit. The Greater Ghost already takes the role of a powerful spirit.
So you mean to say that if its stats were dramatically lowered, then you might vote yay?
Quote from: Chrono on October 13, 2010, 11:18:53 PM
I shall hold my horses.
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 13, 2010, 01:22:17 PM
I don't see the need for a another powerful spirit. The Greater Ghost already takes the role of a powerful spirit.
So you mean to say that if its stats were dramatically lowered, then you might vote yay?
No, because then it's would infringe on the regular Ghost's (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ghost) role.
What about a 3/4 powerful spirit? We have the
- Lesser Ghost (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Lesser_Ghost)
-Which would be a 1/4
- Ghost (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ghost)
-Which would be the 2/4 or 1/2
and the
- Greater Ghost (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Greater_Ghost)
-Which would be a 4/4 or 1
Vengence Ghost could complete the quad in terms of power
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 14, 2010, 06:47:59 AM
What about a 3/4 powerful spirit? We have the
- Lesser Ghost (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Lesser_Ghost)
-Which would be a 1/4
- Ghost (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ghost)
-Which would be the 2/4 or 1/2
and the
- Greater Ghost (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Greater_Ghost)
-Which would be a 4/4 or 1
Vengence Ghost could complete the quad in terms of power
I would love that, but I don't know if im2smart4u would agree. Could you give a suggestion for the stats, though?
Alright. For the Vengeance Ghost:
Vengeance Ghost- A ghost who has remembered a wrong done to it while it was alive. It uses Vengeance on those who do it further harm.
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Immunity: None
Resistance: Physical
Attacks: Mind Blast(Range 1, Damage 12) Cryo Blast(Range 2, Damage 13) Vengeance (Range 1-3, Max Damage 15)
Cryo Blast replaces Feedback... Not a bad idea. I'm voting yay on my idea that was modified by you.
And my explination for it being slightly stronger and healthier is that it's cold fury fuels it.
I'm a yay on that.
Howabout...:
Shadowling Bouncer
HP: 65
Attacks: Mind Blast (Damage: 10), Shadowblast (Damage: 14), Feedback (Returns up to: 20)
Resistance: Shadow
Flying
Counter: None
Maybe he could show up at Shadowboxer and Darkling's bar... A bouncer ought to be able to take some hits, right?
I'm a nay. I have my reasons. Just don't ask for them.
I'm sorry but you asked for it, why?
Hmmm tune it down to vengeance then yay
Only if it's lowered to Feedback in my opinion, having any enemy use Vengeance is ridiculous to me.
Unless it's a boss that is. *shudder* A shadowling with Vendetta!?! You're absolutely mad!!! Can assume that you meant to give it 7 speed as well?!? You might as well. It would only make it better ::).
Quote from: Duckling on October 16, 2010, 09:22:21 PMVendetta Shadowling
HP: 65
Attacks: Mind Blast (Damage: 10), Shadowblast (Damage: 14), Vendetta (Returns up to: 18)
Resistance: Shadow
Flying
If this is too powerful, it can be stepped down to Vengeance, or even Feedback.
I don't see a regular shadowling psy fighter using anything, but shadow attacks and mind blast. Shadowling healers may using shields and shadowling psy assassins may use feedback, but it is hard to imagine a supper powerful shadowling using Vendetta or Vengeance.
Okay, okay. I really didn't want to give it Vengeance, 'cause see above, so I'll give it feedback returning 20.
A particularly powerful shadowling could learn Vengeance. Vendetta is too much, I agree. How'd I know im2smart4u would post on this...?
Yay on "Vengeful" Shadowling.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 14, 2010, 05:43:54 PM
Vengeful Ghost- A ghost who has remembered a wrong done to it while it was alive. It uses Vengeance on those who do it further harm.
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Immunity: None
Resistance: Physical
Attacks: Mind Blast(Range 1, Damage 12) Cryo Blast(Range 2, Damage 13) Vengeance (Range 1-3, Max Damage 15)
Yay:
Buggy
Chrono
Duckling
Nay:
im2smart4u
Duskling
Nay for shadowling.
I think so far nay
Why? Darkling wasn't a particularly exceptional shadowling, and he could learn Feedback. The name sucks, but I could fix that.
I don't like the vengeance shadowling. The name isn't the problem right now. It's the entire concept of it.
Exactly, that's what I mean.
Quote from: Duckling on October 16, 2010, 09:22:21 PMMaybe he could show up at Shadowboxer and Darkling's bar... A bouncer ought to be able to take some hits, right?
What is the need for a powerful bouncer? Shadowboxer and Darkling own a bar; not a club. Also, the brothers are both powerful enough to deal with any drunks or hoodlums.
Quote from: Duckling on October 17, 2010, 12:42:45 PM
Why? Darkling wasn't a particularly exceptional shadowling, and he could learn Feedback. The name sucks, but I could fix that.
Feedback is a skill Psy Assassins use, because it a personal way to kill thier target. Shadowlings Psy Fighters tend to use powerful shadow attacks. Since you are suggesting a powerful shadowling psy fighter, then he shoud use powerful shadow attacks.
Since you are not going to get the nearly unanimous vote needed to get formulated, then it is time to give up.
Unless Sam the Unheard decides to chip in entirely in your favor. What are the thoughts for the Vengeful Spirit?
Well, im2smart4u, aren't you just mister positive today, hmm?
Anyway, the bar thing was just a joke, and bars have bouncers too. Maybe they wouldn't bother with drunks.
There are multiple problems with your statement. First, I never said anything about the Shadowling being a particularly powerful Psy. I simply said that a particularly powerful shadowling could learn Vengeance, were they so inclined. However, the Shadowling with feedback doesn't have to be.
Second, you've managed to, for the fifth time and counting, quote me and say something that has nothing to do with the quote in context. I was saying that you don't need to be exceptional to have Feedback as a shadowling, and you were saying stuff about powerful ones. My point is that some shadowlings other than Darkling could learn Feedback, but not Shadowport, because it's rather difficult to code. You guys were yay on adding an enemy with a teammate's attacks in TRPG2 with your Flame Golem with a flamethrower, but now you're against a shadowling with the easy-to-learn (with a bit of training, but you'd also need that for Dark Vortex, and that's already been established) Feedback.
And while I'm posting, you don't join a dependent clause to an independent one with a semicolon; you should use a comma.
Duckling, do a Buggy and give it up. It's a hopeless cause.
Do a whatnow?
Do an epic fail, he says. (I'm sorry, I couldn't resist and I like my idea)
I honestly don't see the difference. You guys have been proposing other characters of classes from TRPG2 having attacks from their corresponding players in the game, and I think this is just as valid. Maybe it can be one of the attacks of the shadowling assassin in TRPG4, 'cause I think we already have Psy assassins not having Feedback. But ya know how the academy set has Blue Cape (Light) and other capes, and other elements? What if we say Psy Assassin (Feedback), like the two skill branches for Darkling?
Quote from: Duckling on October 17, 2010, 08:40:16 PM
What if we say Psy Assassin (Feedback), like the two skill branches for Darkling?
I am okay with that.
May I count you as a yay?
Nay. I am not enthusiastic enough about it for a yay. (Why does it need such high health when it has feedback?)
I abstain from voting.
Okay. Well, the high health is mostly because other shadowlings with good attacks tend to have health in the fifties to eighties. My difficulty perspective is a bit warped, because I always play on Brutal.
Quote from: Duckling on October 18, 2010, 05:21:35 PM
Okay. Well, the high health is mostly because other shadowlings with good attacks tend to have health in the fifties to eighties. My difficulty perspective is a bit warped, because I always play on Brutal.
If it has feedback, then it will keep healing itself. That means if it starts with 65 heath, then it could end up taking over 100 damage. You have to significantly lower the health.
Unless you were to corner it, it would destroy you.
Okay, I can see where we don't want every shadowling with a particular ability to be a bossfight... how about 35 health? That's about where Darkling and Shadowboxer are (if you don't overtrain like I do) by Mission 4, right?
And it wouldn't (necessarily) destroy you. If you had a healer, you could let most of your troops rest, while one Swordsman hacked away at it, being healed with long shield (so the shadowling doesn't go over and kill the healer), and attack it all at once.
What's the Feedback damage again?
I think is about time for you post new stats. (better name would be nice too).
Psy Assassin (Feedback)
HP: 35
Move: 4
Attacks: Mind Blast (Damage: 10), Feedback (Returns up to: 16)
Resistance: Shadow
Flying
Counter: None
You might want to tone down the damage of Feedback a little bit, say around 13-15. I don't really care if Shadowblast is still an attack that the Shadowling Assassin possesses though.
I don't think you should keep Shadow Blast, if it's just a variation of the Shadowling Assassin.
P.S. It's a yay as long as the Feedback damage is lowered to around 15.
Very well. The modified shadowling gets my vote.
Quote from: Duckling on October 18, 2010, 06:36:15 PM
I'm not sure about the shadowblast, 'cause Darkling could only have one or the other.
I was thinking the same thing.
Quote from: Chrono on October 18, 2010, 06:45:45 PM
You might want to tone down the damage of Feedback a little bit, say around 13-15
I agree.
Make those changes and you have my "yay".
I agree with im2smart4u. I want the changes too.
Changes made. Vote?
Move 4. Yay.
yay
Oh, right... speaking of that, which speed is preferable? Al'al has a speed of 4, but Psy Assassins are more about mind than physical... but shadowlings are pretty fast, so I'm leaning towards four.
Scratch that. Psy assassins have high mobility, so it's going to be four. I hope no one has problems with that.
Nope. I shall keep tally:
Yay
•Buggy
•Duckling
•im2smart4u
•Chrono
Nay
•N/A
Maybe
•N/A
We just need input from Namelesskitty, Duskling, and maybe Mike if he shows up.
Yeah, I like the changes, yay.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 19, 2010, 05:44:14 AM
Psy Assassin (Feedback)
HP: 35
Move: 4
Attacks: Mind Blast (Damage: 10), Feedback (Returns up to: 15)
Resistance: Shadow
Flying
Counter: None
Yay
•Buggy
•Duckling
•im2smart4u
•Chrono
•Namelesskitty
Cypher
Nay
•N/A
Maybe
•N/A
Couldn't you just use the "Modify" instead of reposting the same info?
Yay.
I'm sorry Cypher. I forgot to not forget about you.
So, for the third time maybe?? What are your votes on the Vengeful Ghost?
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 14, 2010, 05:43:54 PM
Vengeful Ghost- A ghost who has remembered a wrong done to it while it was alive. It uses Vengeance on those who do it further harm.
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Immunity: None
Resistance: Physical
Attacks: Mind Blast(Range 1, Damage 12) Cryo Blast(Range 2, Damage 13) Vengeance (Range 1-3, Max Damage 15)
Yaybe.
Nay, I just don't see the need for another ghost. (maybe a healer)
I vote yay for the psy assassin, nay for the ghost. I agree with im2smart4u about the ghost; we have 3 or 4 types of offensive ghosts already. A ghost healer would be nice:
Ghost Healer (not exactly a good name, feel free to change)
Health: 28 (two more than a ghost, since healers have higher defense than fighters)
Attacks: Mind Shield
Speed: 3
Don't forget to give it mind blast! If you havn't noticed yet, all enemy healers have an offensive attack now. Look at the Red/Frost Spriggat Healers. They have their corosponding breath. And shadowling healers have mind blast. Acoylites have light blast. It needs an offensive move.
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 13, 2010, 10:01:48 PM
Ghost Healer-This spirit doesn't remember much, but he does remember how to heal.
Stats Health: 18
Steps: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 4), Mind Shield (Range: 1, Healing: 14)
Resistance: Physical
Im2smart4u's version gets my yay.
Sorry, I didn't see the original version of the Ghost Healer. It sounds okay to me. I vote yaybe. 18 health is a little low, but I admit 28 is too high.
Yaybe.
Yaybe
Alright, I know I said yaybe to, but three yaybes doesn't get us anywhere. What do you guys not like about the idea? I said the health was a little low. I'm thinking about:
Ghost Healer-This spirit doesn't remember much, but he does remember how to heal.
Stats Health: 22
Steps: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 4), Mind Shield (Range: 1, Healing: 14)
Resistance: Physical
What do you think?
Yeah I'll go with a big yaybe on this.
The health is a lot more acceptable like this.
Solid yes. Make up your mind THN and Duckling.
Quote from: yogc elf on October 21, 2010, 07:44:48 PM
Ghost Healer-This spirit doesn't remember much, but he does remember how to heal.
Stats Health: 22
Steps: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 4), Mind Shield (Range: 1, Healing: 14)
Resistance: Physical
What do you think?
I okay with that.
Please, stop saying "yaybe". Please say either say "yay" or "maybe".
Yay for the Ghost Healer with 22 Health
Yay for twenty two health.
Nay. Hate to be a nay-sayer, but I could get rid of one with a single Cyro blast. I don't see it as worth adding in.
Quote from: Duckling on October 22, 2010, 03:22:32 PM
Nay. Hate to be a nay-sayer, but I could get rid of one with a single Cyro blast. I don't see it as worth adding in.
You don't see where a healer could come in? Bandits (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Bandit_Healer), Guardsmen (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ravinale_Healer), Bugs (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Nymph), Psy Academy (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Black_Cape_(Healer)), Shadowlings (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Shadowling_Healer), Spiggats (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Frost_Spriggat_(Healer)), and est. have all have healers, because they become a serious threat and challenge.
I think the Healer's health should be higher then a regular Ghost (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ghost). I don't really care that much about the stats. I just think that entities that are entirely made up of psy energy should be able to heal.
I never said that, as you so mercilessly took my post for what it didn't mean.
I see a place for it, but the Ghost enemies that are of low difficulty like your Healer are already in-game. For it to work for me, it would have to have circa 45 or 50 health.
Quote from: Duckling on October 22, 2010, 04:28:34 PM
I never said that, as you so mercilessly took my post for what it didn't mean.
Then maybe you need to be more clear in what you type, so your words don't become misinterpreted.
Quote from: Duckling on October 22, 2010, 04:28:34 PM
I see a place for it, but the Ghost enemies that are of low difficulty like your Healer are already in-game. For it to work for me, it would have to have circa 45 or 50 health.
45 or 50 is ridiculously high health (it already has physical resistance). The
Ghost Healer's health needs to be between the Ghost (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ghost) and Greater Ghost (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Greater_Ghost). Maybe 32.
32 seems kinda high, 25- 27 maybe in that range, possibly extending as high as 29.
Or maybe 22 could be a lesser healer then there could be a regular or greater healer?
Hmm... I don't know.
Well, do you have a better idea?
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 22, 2010, 04:59:38 PM
Hmm... I don't know.
Don't post just to post. If you don't have an opinion, then don't post.
Can we all compromise on 28?
That was a maybe for the adjusted health.
I don't think we're voting yet, we're still tweaking the design, and be more specific next time.
Well that was my prevote vote.
Well, no such thing exists and maybe or undecided is not a vote, you may as well not vote, saying that you lean towards on direction is alright, but complete opinionlessness is an unjustified vote.
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 21, 2010, 10:54:42 PM
Ghost Healer-This spirit doesn't remember much, but he does remember how to heal.
Stats Health: 28
Steps: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 4), Mind Shield (Range: 1, Healing: 14)
Resistance: Physical
What do you think?
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 22, 2010, 05:02:35 PMCan we all compromise on 28?
28 sounds nice, well rounded but not crazy.
I'm Switzerland on this.
Please don't do that, it's a waste and only to increase your post count, if you're neutral then you don't need to express that opinion.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on October 22, 2010, 09:05:28 PM
I'm Switzerland on this.
It obvious to everyone that you are posting useless comments to increase your post count. Even if the moderators are gone I can still report you to Craig for spamming.
What's been going on? I've been gone for 2 days and I can't catch up.
I'm a yay for the Ghost Healer, by the way.
Im2smart4u and I are chewing bugfartboy out for posting for the sake of post count.
Wow, that's all that happened for 2 pages? :| No new enemy ideas?
Oh you mean long term, we tweaked the health and ended up with an agreeable 28 after two days of compromise.
OK, I read that one and voted yay. I'm going to work on a new enemy idea, so expect it soon!
Wonderful I can't wait to see it I'll work on one too, because I support creativity.
Yay on 28 health.
Yay on 28 health, and to whoever it was that said the health was far to low, it is (assumedly) the health for Normal difficulty and will be scaled up. Also, the Ghost set that this fits in appears early, before you even get Cyro Blast.
My point was that all the early ghost battles in which a low-health healer would fit have already been implemented.
yeah, but 50 health is insanely high.
Sorry about that. It isn't insane on Brutal.
I mean for the character itself, that's simply too high.
Quote from: Duckling on October 23, 2010, 11:01:24 AM
Sorry about that. It isn't insane on Brutal.
We vote for the health on normal; not what it increases to on brutal. If you don't like 28, then vote nay. Since the majority like 28, I am not going to change it again for you.
I know. I was just saying why my perspective was a little warped, and I apologize.
I vote a full yay.
Oh, it might have just been a misunderstanding, I'm glad that was cleared up, I play on normal so I assumed that was the health for every difficulty.
How many more yays are required, if that is the case?
Is there a running poll, or are we screaming votes into the void?
Quote from: im2smart4u on October 13, 2010, 10:01:48 PM
Ghost Healer-This spirit doesn't remember much, but he does remember how to heal.
Stats Health: 28
Steps: 3
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 4), Mind Shield (Range: 1, Healing: 14)
Resistance: Physical
Time to vote.
Yay:
*The Holy namelesskitty
*Chrono
*Cypher
*im2smart4u
*MikeW781
*Duckling
*TheWanderingShadow
Nay:
N/A
I guess it's decided then. :)
I think we should wait for one more yay, but if there are no more votes by the end of the day, then I am going to formulate it.
I say Yay.
I shall now formulate it ;D.
Turret
Move: 0
Health: 50
Attacks:
Arrow
Range: 3 or 2 but not both.
Damage: 6
Catapult
Range: 4
Damage: 20
A powerful tower made solely for defense of a castle of fortress, while powerful from a range feebler in close combat. And armed with catapults and archerers.
A)The game engine doesn't allow for enemies that take up more then one space.
B)It has been discused before, and everyone came to the conclusion that siege engines wouldn't make good enemies for a multitude of reasons.
C)There are already archers that have a range 2 or 3.
D)Your turret sounds like a less effective Tig/Energy Golem.
A. It takes up one space, it's on a castle or fortress exterior.
B. It's not a siege engine.
C. Tha's why the arrows go that far, they could possibly go four but that's the distance a catapult fires and catapults are more destructive than arrows.
D. There are supposed to be three or four on a fortress, and the attacks seem a little weak, if you have suggestions please offer them.
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on October 23, 2010, 10:37:05 PM
A. It takes up one space, it's on a castle or fortress exterior.
So a catapult and an archer are both on one space? ::)
Yes, a turret is a tower with a catapult on top and an archer inside.
Methinks we have ourselves some scaling issues.
I think that people are enlarged because I can shoot an arrow much farther than three people lying down head to foot, even people like you. The scale fits.
I never said that there were scaling issues with your scheme. It's just that there are, nonetheless, discrepancies amongst scales throughout the game. I just don't know how the art will be impacted, and how it would look if there were a bunch of people one size, and then there were tiny people elsewhere.
You don't need to, show just a turret from the top no need to get people involved.
Nameless: one word.
NAY. I don't like it. And it does seem like a less effective energy golem.
That was way more than one word. And I'm thinking of adding somextra oomph to the arrows and catapults.
Heres a Ghost enemy, that I would like to see in the game:
Ghost Dragon
Health: 50
Speed: 7
Attacks: Bite (Range: 1, Damage: 5), Tail Spin (Range : 1, Damage: 7)
Resistance: Physical
Now this is the right place to pot your idea Tom. But this may just be me but I don't think dragons have a place in the Telepath universe. Sorry. And spriggats ARE the dragons of the Telepath universe. They breathe fire, ice, AND shadow. Maybe if it were a sprigat ghost. Hmm...
Sorry, but I don't like the idea of ghost spriggats. It's like telling us to make a ghost version of every enemy.
Cerra Bella isn't really the place for dragons. I also think becoming spirits is a human anomalie, so don't think there will be shadowlings, wood-folk, or spriggat spirits.
That makes sense. But there really is no place for dragons.
[spoiler]Bug spirits. Ha ha[/spoiler]
Just to make it official though, votes? Nay.
Nay for ghost dragons too. I think we have enough ghost type enemies, so let's try something else.
Nay for ghost dragon. I'm with Chrono.
I'll say nay as well, as a dragon would seem out of place, so a ghost dragon would be even worse off.
A shadowling ghost would be fearsome indeed -- but let's not go there on All Hallow's Eve.
How about these then?
Ravinale Crusader
Health: 40
Speed: 5
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 7), Double Strike (Range: 1, Damage: 10)
Iron Golem
Health: 45
Speed: 2
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 10), Earthquake (Range: Omnidirectional, Damage: 13)
3x3 square? Why not just call it omnidirectional? Otherwise the golem would hurt itself. And how would such earthquake occur?
Ravinale Crusader sounds a little iffy. I'm warm you that some people take this very seriously and will find several if not many flaws with it. *cough* *gag* im2smart4u *cough* *hack*.
The golem would simply hit the ground hard enough to make it shake and hurt everyone nearby, except himself.
Quote from: tomcia369 on November 01, 2010, 07:14:16 AMRavinale Crusader
Health: 40
Speed: 5
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 7), Double Strike (Range: 1, Damage: 10)
I don't see the need when we already have the Ravinale Swordsman (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ravinale_Swordsman) and Ravinale Myrmidon (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ravinale_Myrmidon). I do like the enemy's name.
Quote from: tomcia369 on November 01, 2010, 07:14:16 AMIron Golem
Health: 45
Speed: 2
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 10), Earthquake (Range: Omnidirectional, Damage: 13)
Earthquake? Really? This isn't pokemon.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on November 01, 2010, 07:37:47 AM*cough* *gag* im2smart4u *cough* *hack*.
Sorry to rain on your parade, but all of your many attempts at humor have failed. If you are not funny, then don't try to be funny.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on November 01, 2010, 07:37:47 AM
*cough* *gag* im2smart4u *cough* *hack*.
Honestly Buggy, please stop being an ass to him. So you don't like him. Grow up, and deal with it. No need to try to start something EVERY time you post in this thread. He's already shown he's more mature than you by not rising to the bait, and I'm sick of seing this.
Also, I do not like either of those ideas. They aren't bad, but their only issue is that they are too similar to existing characters. Especially the Ravinale Crusader, which is essentially the Swordsman on Brutal. Double Strike may be a new attack to use for an enemy, but its just a more powerful Melee.
It seems that most people are suggesting enemies that either: don't fit the Telepath universe or are just clones of previous enemies. I think if we are to suggest any new enemy: maybe we can experiment with different weapons and combinations of Psy Power/Melee Attacks. What I mean is have enemies with different weapons (with different ranges) or have enemies that mix the line between Psy and Melee. As for Weapon ideas: Scythes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War-scythe), Hammers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_hammer), Clubs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Club_%28weapon%29), and Quarterstaffs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarterstaff) etc.
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 01, 2010, 10:32:07 AM
Quote from: tomcia369 on November 01, 2010, 07:14:16 AMRavinale Crusader
Health: 40
Speed: 5
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 7), Double Strike (Range: 1, Damage: 10)
I don't see the need when we already have the Ravinale Swordsman (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ravinale_Swordsman) and Ravinale Myrmidon (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ravinale_Myrmidon). I do like the enemy's name.
Ravinale Crusader, huh? That's a pretty ironic name right there.
Quote from: Zackirus on November 01, 2010, 05:20:32 PMAs for Weapon ideas: Scythes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War-scythe), Hammers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_hammer), Clubs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Club_%28weapon%29), and Quarterstaffs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarterstaff) etc.
The Scythe needs to remain unique to Zem the Reaper. The Club and Quaretstaff are boring for just being pieces of wood. The Hammer would work.
Honestly, I think we covered every necessary enemy (and many unnecessary enemies). You can keep suggesting, but I don't think we need more enemies. I also want to point out that of all the formulations, Craig has only showed interest in one attack (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=209.msg25287#msg25287) and one enemy (http://sinisterdesign.freepowerboards.com/viewtopic.php?p=27706#p27706).
Ravinale Ram:
Health: 30
PsP: N/A
Speed: 1
Attacks: Melee (Damage: 6), Ram (Damage: 16, Range: 2) (Relocates to 1 square forward, like Leap, but 1)
This enemy carries a large ram, and as such is rather slow. However, don't underestimate its power; it's not fun to get hit by one, and if you aren't careful, the Ravinale Ram could be the last enemy seen by a weakened unit. Keep this one cornered to keep its full potential under control.
(If possible, would be preferable if this enemy could not turn and ram on the same move, so that the effect of "ramming" might be preserved. However, as this would be difficult to program given the apparent inflexibility of Craig's game engine (no offense meant), this would probably be best left out as a feature)
What is the point of a Ram? Are we going to have a Wall or Door class teammate?
No, just as a more powerful enemy.
@im2smart4u
No. Don't be ridiculous. We are not going to have a "Wall" or "Door" class teammate any more than we will have "Small Furry Critter" teammate when facing scorpions, not would we have a "Tree" teammate if there were to be an enemy with a battleaxe.
The point of the Ram is that it is a useful tool for dealing with people that don't want to open their door in the middle of the night for the Cult to be dragged away to a dungeon somewhere. It just so happens that Rams could be useful if the occupants of said house (or cellar, as the case may be) have swords, bows, knives, Psy control, shields, spears, and fire breath, and retaliate.
Quote from: Duckling on November 01, 2010, 09:14:33 PMNo. Don't be ridiculous. We are not going to have a "Wall" or "Door" class teammate any more than we will have "Small Furry Critter" teammate when facing scorpions, not would we have a "Tree" teammate if there were to be an enemy with a battleaxe.
The point of the Ram is that it is a useful tool for dealing with people that don't want to open their door in the middle of the night for the Cult to be dragged away to a dungeon somewhere. It just so happens that Rams could be useful if the occupants of said house (or cellar, as the case may be) have swords, bows, knives, Psy control, shields, spears, and fire breath, and retaliate.
A)In the intro of the story, it shows the Guard breaking open the door without a ram.
B)Your battleaxe example is horribley dumb. A battleaxe is designed to kill infantrymen; not trees. A ram is designed to attack stationary structures; not infantrymen.
C)It is stupid to think that anyone would use a ram as a weapon. When raiding a house, the guy would ram open the door and step aside to let team members rush in. The person with the ram either stays where he is or he drops the ram and rushes in with a diffrent weapon.
I agree. Nay on the ram.
With three nays, one yay, and one maybe, ram dies.
[spoiler=Don't mind this if you're gonna take me seriously]Dah dah dah, another one bites the dust.
Dah dah dah, another one b-ites the dust. [/spoiler]
Make that four nays. I think I like the name Ravinale Crusader, but I really don't see the worth, except maybe as a boss (or several bosses).
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 01, 2010, 11:43:09 PM
A)In the intro of the story, it shows the Guard breaking open the door without a ram.
Some people have stronger doors than others.
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 01, 2010, 11:43:09 PM
B)Your battleaxe example is horribley dumb. A battleaxe is designed to kill infantrymen; not trees. A ram is designed to attack stationary structures; not infantrymen
Says the guy that forgot to drop the "e" when he adds "ly".
Your sheer oppressive vanity is showing. I was using a battleaxe as a better way to relate to battle. If you so choose to point out the flaw in the analogy, think for a second about how else the analogy could work, rather than deeming anything you don't have time to conemplate dumb. People kill other people with fire axes (also for knocking down doors), pickaxes, woodaxes, and hatchets if other weapons are unavailable.
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 01, 2010, 11:43:09 PM
C)It is stupid to think that anyone would use a ram as a weapon. When raiding a house, the guy would ram open the door and step aside to let team members rush in. The person with the ram either stays where he is or he drops the ram and rushes in with a diffrent weapon.
There you go making personal remarks again. Who exactly is saying that anyone would use a ram as a weapon?
It is truly ridiculous to think that anyone would use a long, heavy stick on a horse to dismount the other bloke on a horse when they could, instead, hack at the horse with a broadsword. In the sense of the sheer devastating power of the lance, the ram could just as well be used as such. When the cavalry charge is over, he dismounts so as not to unnecessarily risk his horse, and continues hacking at the enemy with a broadsword again.
Buggy, your spoiler got the cause and effect wrong. If we mind it, we cease to take you seriously.
Ducky, four nays is almost enough to get it killed. One more and we have over half of the necessary votes to make a decision. Would Sam like to speak it's mind on the matter?
Quote from: Duckling on November 02, 2010, 09:08:53 PM
Some people have stronger doors than others.
Not strong enough to actually require a ram, unless we're talking mansions with paranoid owners here.
Quote from: Duckling on November 02, 2010, 09:08:53 PM
Who exactly is saying that anyone would use a ram as a weapon?
If that's the case, wouldn't he already dismount and attack us with a sword? I don't see the point of having a ram anywhere as far as we're concerned.
Quote from: Chrono on November 03, 2010, 05:28:04 PM
Quote from: Duckling on November 02, 2010, 09:08:53 PM
Some people have stronger doors than others.
Not strong enough to actually require a ram, unless we're talking mansions with paranoid owners here.
Or if you happen to be living in a literal fortress. And does the Hero? I don't think so.
Personally, I think a ram would be a little awkward to carry around and use as a weapon. Plus, why would the effect of using a (presumably) small ram cause the mover to move forward and extra space? And how would the person holding the ram melee a unit for so little damage? Couldn't they slam the person at close range? If not, then how else would they hit the person?
If you really want a heavy hitting infantry unit (aside from slow moving golems) try a war hammer or a mace. Ram just doesn't sound like the thing a guy would bring with him into combat.
Okay; how about a lance? Any people that will shoot that down on sight? I think it sounds like a Mechanic thing to do.
A lance? It sounds outside of the time period. We have spears, pikes, swords, sythes, bows, knives, and more. Lance doesn't seem to fit.
Quote from: Duckling on November 03, 2010, 09:22:20 PM
Okay; how about a lance? Any people that will shoot that down on sight?
Isn't a lance just a spear on horseback? It would be pointless in a world without horses.
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 03, 2010, 11:39:18 PM
Quote from: Duckling on November 03, 2010, 09:22:20 PM
Okay; how about a lance? Any people that will shoot that down on sight?
Isn't a lance just a spear on horseback? It would be pointless in a world without horses.
It isn't yet proven that there aren't any horses on Cera Bella, but I agree that, until there is proof, this enemy should be put on hold.
Horses would be really difficult to animate in square format, I say this as a graphic designer.
Didn't we have this duscussion already, but with scorpions, and people riding them? The kid in the Marid Clan Camp had a pet scorpion, so why no ridden ones?
Uh, maybe it's just THE HUGE STINGERS COMING FROM THEIR BACK!!! That and it would be difficult to design.
Not in favor of scorpion riding.
Official vote
Nay
•Chrono
•Buggy
How, exactly, would it be difficult to design?
And I didn't come up with this idea; I am not looking for a vote, here, either.
See? Easy to design.
Quote from: Duckling on November 05, 2010, 11:32:29 PM
How, exactly, would it be difficult to design?
You can't fit a large horse in a small square.
Count me as a Nay for all mounts.
Keep yourself informed, im2smart4u. We're talking about mounted riders on scorpions. If pets, why not war vehicles?
So the scorpion stabs his stinger through the rider to hit his enemy? That seems dumb.
We would never see a scorpion rider, because they would be in the clans. The clans are neutral or allies in the game, so what is the point of an enemy who we will never fight?
Quote from: Duckling on November 05, 2010, 11:40:35 PM
Keep yourself informed, im2smart4u. We're talking about mounted riders on scorpions. If pets, why not war vehicles?
You're digressing. That didn't make much sense, and if you're using it to suggest ideas similar to the catapult, nay.
When you destroy said war vehicle, it's likely the people in it will die. Scratch that. I don't want to be stuck in a battle with at least one enemy with mental immunity. That's my main concern.
It makes no possible sense, nay.
Official Vote:
Nay
•Chrono
•Buggy
•THN
•im2smart4u
Yay
•Ducky
Is anyone else thinking that the idea is dead?
I NEVER VOTED YAY, NOR DID I CALL FOR A VOTE!!
The relations with the Rubats are yet to be decided, are they not?
As with a horseman, it is not the scorpion that attacks, but the rider, with a weapon of their own.
I'm not digressing; you're the one not making sense, Chrono. I can obviously see that although a Siege Ballista makes perfect sense, given the technology available to the Mechanics, it didn't fly.
I am referring to anything ridden in war as a "war vehicle" (Vehicle: any mean by which something is carried or conveyed), and I think if scorpions can be trained not to kill kids in the clans, they could be trained not to kill their riders.
Also, Chrono, if you don't want to be stuck in a battle with "at least one enemy with mental resistance", you'll have to refuse to play the game; many enemies have mental resistance.
Holy Namelesskitty, you're only expressing how the general community is prebiased against this idea. What do you mean, "It makes no possible sense, nay." It makes plenty of sense, and if they have backstories like friendly characters riding the scorpions so you can ask about them more, so as to not be in the dark about them.
Buggy, if people were not so prejudiced against the idea, I think it might fly, but however, since everyone "knows" that a scorpion rider "wouldn't owrk", it's probably best to lest the idea die. R.I.P., scorpion rider.
Quote from: Duckling on November 06, 2010, 08:59:47 AM
I NEVER VOTED YAY, NOR DID I CALL FOR A VOTE!!
You don't get to tell us when and when we can't vote. Everyone, but you was ready to vote, so Bugfartboy tallied the vote.
Quote from: Duckling on November 06, 2010, 08:59:47 AMAs with a horseman, it is not the scorpion that attacks, but the rider, with a weapon of their own.
Then what is the point of riding a scorpion? People ride horses because of their speed, yet a scorpion is just as fast as a bandit.
Maybe they use their speed of 3 all the time when ridden by a willful rider, as opposed to just in lunges.
And Ducky, you can't say that you hadn't said yay or nay. You had been officially defending the idea, therefore it was counted as a yay seeing as you had yet said otherwise. And Ducky, scorpions are as fast as a bandit, they pose no tactical advantage to the enemy, and are difficult to design. And by unanimous vote, you were creating so your vote is a minor, the idea was rejected and turned down. Now please move on.
Ducky, it seems that you need to cool your head off.
Firstly, read what I wrote. I did say
immunity, not resistance. Those are two different things. If you want to quote, do so properly, like this.
Quote from: Chrono on November 06, 2010, 12:10:12 AM
I don't want to be stuck in a battle with at least one enemy with mental immunity.
Unless you're saying that machines have minds, I will have an automatic nay vote on machines.
Secondly, read what you wrote.
Quote from: Duckling on November 05, 2010, 11:40:35 PM
We're talking about mounted riders on scorpions. If pets, why not war vehicles?
Does this make sense to anyone else?
Nope. And the votes been taken. Idea dead. Moving on.
Ravinale Sentinel:
Health: 95
Psp: N/A
Speed: 2
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 20), Hammer Stike (Range: 1-2 1-3 Across; Damage: 18)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Hammer Stirke:
OOOOO
OXXXO
OXXXO
OOROO
OOOOO
This enemy would appear much later in the game (Almost at the end) I assume it would be the "Shadowling Guardian" of Ravinale. They would use their Cult Powers (A.KA: Psy Powers) to Accelerate their Hammers an drive them into the ground, sendings a shockwave of energy. The hammer extists because you need a hammer of some sort to make weapons in the first place.
I like it. Craig might already have some sort of guardian class for the final boss set up, but if he hasn't, this should definately be it. Im for it.
I like it. If Craig doesn't have anything else in mind. Woot! An idea worth a Woot! Has finally arrived! Me say Yay!
I'm thinking "Hammer Strike" shouldn't have the range of "Dark Vortex," but, if it was like this,
Hammer Strike
OOOOO
OXXXO
OOXOO
OOROO
OOOOO,
Then I'd be all for it, so a maybe for now.
Quote from: Zackirus on November 10, 2010, 04:00:40 PMThey would use their Cult Powers (A.KA: Psy Powers) to Accelerate their Hammers an drive them into the ground, sendings a shockwave of energy. The hammer extists because you need a hammer of some sort to make weapons in the first place.
Wouldn't the shockwave be a gust of air? I don't think that would hurt anyone.
How would you explain air blast?
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 10, 2010, 07:44:51 PM
Wouldn't the shockwave be a gust of air? I don't think that would hurt anyone.
Think about Tastidian's Shocken but the energy is focused into the head of the hammer (and not that powerful).
Also: With the range, it is less than the Shadowling Guardians, but it does do more damage. Also Ravinale Sentinel can only move 2 because its amour is heavy enough to weigh it down.
Shadowling Guardian: Damage: 16OOOOO
OXXXO
OXXXO
OXXXO
OOSOO
OOOOO
Ravinale Sentinel: Damage: 18OOOOO
OXXXO
OXXXO
OOROO
OOOOO
Not bad. I like the idea.
About the shockwave, am I correct in assuming it is created by the sentinel slamming his hammer into the ground? I don't know how well that would work in real life, but it looks cool. I think I like Zackirus's range of the attack better.
Quote from: Zackirus on November 10, 2010, 09:00:04 PM
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 10, 2010, 07:44:51 PM
Wouldn't the shockwave be a gust of air? I don't think that would hurt anyone.
Think about Tastidian's Shocken but the energy is focused into the head of the hammer (and not that powerful).
The damage caused by Tastidian's Shockwave (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Shockwave) is from a massive amount of intense radiation. The force distributing the radiation wouldn't damage anything. It is impossible with or without psy powers for a hammer to cause damage by moving air. Even being hit by hurricane force winds wouldn't hurt you as long the winds are not carring dangerous debris.
How do you explain air blast? Doesn't it use air?
Fine then, how about the hammer strikes are essentially the same attack element as shockwave, but the Cult use the hammers to focus the attack (the hammers could have Psy- increasing abilities like orbs almost), because they believe it is Yawah aiding their hammer and not Psy abilities, and because it makes it look like this to other people.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on November 11, 2010, 07:02:01 AM
How do you explain air blast? Doesn't it use air?
An air blast also wouldn't be able to hurt anyone. At most, it will be able to push you back and fall on your butt. The fall might hurt you, but the air itself wouldn't.
Quote from: MikeW781 on November 11, 2010, 08:35:46 AM
Fine then, how about the hammer strikes are essentially the same attack element as shockwave, but the Cult use the hammers to focus the attack (the hammers could have Psy- increasing abilities like orbs almost), because they believe it is Yawah aiding their hammer and not Psy abilities, and because it makes it look like this to other people.
So they fuse a hammer attack with the light element? Since the shockwave-like attack is the only thing doing damage, then what is the point of hammer? No one has ever been seen combining elements with melee weapons, so what makes the Sentinel special?
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 11, 2010, 10:05:38 AM
Quote from: MikeW781 on November 11, 2010, 08:35:46 AM
Fine then, how about the hammer strikes are essentially the same attack element as shockwave, but the Cult use the hammers to focus the attack (the hammers could have Psy- increasing abilities like orbs almost), because they believe it is Yawah aiding their hammer and not Psy abilities, and because it makes it look like this to other people.
So they fuse a hammer attack with the light element? Since the shockwave-like attack is the only thing doing damage, then what is the point of hammer? No one has ever been seen combining elements with melee weapons, so what makes the Sentinel special?
They use shockwave, but instead of clapping their hands like Tastidian, they swing a hammer. It allows them to believe that Yawah is aiding them, instead of realizing they are Psys. Its not a great explanation, but I think that this is a good idea, and we haven't gotten many of those recently. It would be dumb if a good idea fell through because we didn't have the imagination to explain it. Could you prehaps try to offer an alternative?
Yay:
Zackirus
Bugfartboy
MikeW781
Yogc Elf
Maybe:
Duskling
Also: The attack is still a physical attack or should I change it to light.
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 11, 2010, 10:05:38 AM
Quote from: Bugfartboy on November 11, 2010, 07:02:01 AM
How do you explain air blast? Doesn't it use air?
An air blast also wouldn't be able to hurt anyone. At most, it will be able to push you back and fall on your butt. The fall might hurt you, but the air itself wouldn't.
Well, a shock wave from a bomb (blast wave) is basically a shock wave of air supported by a trailing exothermic reaction. The air is condensed and flying at insane speeds, several times faster than a hurricane, and it would be a little extreme for a person to create the same effect with a hammer and psy abilities, but the air itself can and will kill you, or at least give you a concussion.
Quote from: yogc elf on November 11, 2010, 02:48:19 PMWell, a shock wave from a bomb (blast wave) is basically a shock wave of air supported by a trailing exothermic reaction. The air is condensed and flying at insane speeds, several times faster than a hurricane, and it would be a little extreme for a person to create the same effect with a hammer and psy abilities, but the air itself can and will kill you, or at least give you a concussion.
So you are saying that the hammer creates an explosion? If an explostion extends from the hammer, then it would kill the Sentinel too, because the Sentinel woud be standing right next to the explosion.
Nay
There are such things as shaped charges you know.
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 11, 2010, 06:10:44 PM
Quote from: yogc elf on November 11, 2010, 02:48:19 PMWell, a shock wave from a bomb (blast wave) is basically a shock wave of air supported by a trailing exothermic reaction. The air is condensed and flying at insane speeds, several times faster than a hurricane, and it would be a little extreme for a person to create the same effect with a hammer and psy abilities, but the air itself can and will kill you, or at least give you a concussion.
So you are saying that the hammer creates an explosion? If an explostion extends from the hammer, then it would kill the Sentinel too, because the Sentinel woud be standing right next to the explosion.
No, I am saying the impact from the hammer creates a shock wave similar to the that of an explosion, only weaker, with no exothermic reaction. Instead, the hammer travels through the air and hits the ground with enough force to alter the density and speed of the air (and the ground, to some degree). Because the way the sentinel swings the hammer, and the way it hits the ground, the shock wave would be focus forward, like a shaped charge.
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 11, 2010, 06:10:44 PM
Quote from: yogc elf on November 11, 2010, 02:48:19 PMWell, a shock wave from a bomb (blast wave) is basically a shock wave of air supported by a trailing exothermic reaction. The air is condensed and flying at insane speeds, several times faster than a hurricane, and it would be a little extreme for a person to create the same effect with a hammer and psy abilities, but the air itself can and will kill you, or at least give you a concussion.
So you are saying that the hammer creates an explosion? If an explostion extends from the hammer, then it would kill the Sentinel too, because the Sentinel woud be standing right next to the explosion.
Nay
You have yet to adress my post.
Quote from: MikeW781 on November 11, 2010, 10:51:35 AM
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 11, 2010, 10:05:38 AM
Quote from: MikeW781 on November 11, 2010, 08:35:46 AM
Fine then, how about the hammer strikes are essentially the same attack element as shockwave, but the Cult use the hammers to focus the attack (the hammers could have Psy- increasing abilities like orbs almost), because they believe it is Yawah aiding their hammer and not Psy abilities, and because it makes it look like this to other people.
So they fuse a hammer attack with the light element? Since the shockwave-like attack is the only thing doing damage, then what is the point of hammer? No one has ever been seen combining elements with melee weapons, so what makes the Sentinel special?
They use shockwave, but instead of clapping their hands like Tastidian, they swing a hammer. It allows them to believe that Yawah is aiding them, instead of realizing they are Psys. Its not a great explanation, but I think that this is a good idea, and we haven't gotten many of those recently. It would be dumb if a good idea fell through because we didn't have the imagination to explain it. Could you prehaps try to offer an alternative?
Yay for the hammer.
Quote from: MikeW781 on November 11, 2010, 10:51:35 AMQuote from: im2smart4u on November 11, 2010, 10:05:38 AMQuote from: MikeW781 on November 11, 2010, 08:35:46 AMFine then, how about the hammer strikes are essentially the same attack element as shockwave, but the Cult use the hammers to focus the attack (the hammers could have Psy- increasing abilities like orbs almost), because they believe it is Yawah aiding their hammer and not Psy abilities, and because it makes it look like this to other people.
So they fuse a hammer attack with the light element? Since the shockwave-like attack is the only thing doing damage, then what is the point of hammer? No one has ever been seen combining elements with melee weapons, so what makes the Sentinel special?
They use shockwave, but instead of clapping their hands like Tastidian, they swing a hammer. It allows them to believe that Yawah is aiding them, instead of realizing they are Psys. Its not a great explanation, but I think that this is a good idea, and we haven't gotten many of those recently. It would be dumb if a good idea fell through because we didn't have the imagination to explain it.
What do you exspect me to say? You said that your idea is so superior that is doesn't need necessaries like logic and reason. I feel like I am prosecutting a criminal who says he is above the law.
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 12, 2010, 01:20:20 AM
Quote from: MikeW781 on November 11, 2010, 10:51:35 AMQuote from: im2smart4u on November 11, 2010, 10:05:38 AMQuote from: MikeW781 on November 11, 2010, 08:35:46 AMFine then, how about the hammer strikes are essentially the same attack element as shockwave, but the Cult use the hammers to focus the attack (the hammers could have Psy- increasing abilities like orbs almost), because they believe it is Yawah aiding their hammer and not Psy abilities, and because it makes it look like this to other people.
So they fuse a hammer attack with the light element? Since the shockwave-like attack is the only thing doing damage, then what is the point of hammer? No one has ever been seen combining elements with melee weapons, so what makes the Sentinel special?
They use shockwave, but instead of clapping their hands like Tastidian, they swing a hammer. It allows them to believe that Yawah is aiding them, instead of realizing they are Psys. Its not a great explanation, but I think that this is a good idea, and we haven't gotten many of those recently. It would be dumb if a good idea fell through because we didn't have the imagination to explain it.
What do you exspect me to say? You said that your idea is so superior that is doesn't need necessaries like logic and reason. I feel like I am prosecutting a criminal who says he is above the law.
No. I said that a good idea, which is not mine by the way, should not be shot down by something as simple as a poor explanation, and that we need a better one. The idea is good, and the area and strength of the attacks make sense, we just need to fix the idea a bit. You should stop just telling us to scrap the idea due to a flaw that can be fixed, and maybe offer a solution for a change. It does very little good to your credibility to shut down ideas all the time, without considering that while an idea may not be fit for submission, it could be edited to do so. This idea especially is a solid idea that you have no flaws in except in its backstory, which can be changed with no edit to the good parts of the idea.
They could even scrap the hammer and just use Yawah's fire to do the same area and damage. Regardless, we should edit the idea instead of killing it completely.
Agreed. This unit would fit in nicely near the end of the game once we figure out the second attack. Alternatively, if we cannot agree on the attack, we could have them play a role similar to that of the Phantom Armors (slow moving, heavily armored, and packs a punch).
What about if he were to swing his Hammer in the shape of his attack and use his "Cult Powers" to all the squares, sort of like Impale. However, when he melee's a target, he will swing his hammer downwards, making for a devasting blow.
Oi!! I'm a nay as well, and don't you guys dare say it's out of spite. This seems like too many other jumping, earthquake, area attacks that show up in just about every other RPG. TRPG series is unique, and I don't want to sacrifice the out-of-the-ordinary feel for something that isn't, as far as I'm concerned, a very great idea.
NAY.
I am proposing not an Earthquake like attack but an attack that is somewhat like Impale. The Sentinel swings his hammer in the shape of his attack never hitting the ground. What do you say if the enemy doesn't have an "eathquake" like attack Duckling.
Sorry. I was a couple of pages out of date.
The health is too high, in my opinion.
The Health is for Brutal (which I play on), which is just a bit lower than a Dark Spriggat. I guess it would be 80-85 on Normal, also it does appear at the end of the game.
Can someone repost the stats for clarity?
Quote from: Zackirus on November 10, 2010, 04:00:40 PM
Ravinale Sentinel:
Health: 95
Psp: N/A
Speed: 2
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 20), Hammer Stike (Range: 1-2 1-3 Across; Damage: 18)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Hammer Stirke:
OOOOO
OXXXO
OXXXO
OOROO
OOOOO
This enemy would appear much later in the game (Almost at the end) I assume it would be the "Shadowling Guardian" of Ravinale. They would use their Cult Powers (A.KA: Psy Powers) to Accelerate their Hammers an drive them into the ground, sendings a shockwave of energy. The hammer extists because you need a hammer of some sort to make weapons in the first place.
Vote: Yay
Quote from: Zackirus on November 10, 2010, 04:00:40 PMHammer Stirke:
OOOOO
OXXXO
OXXXO
OOROO
OOOOO
If you look back at the fight against the Shadowling Guardians and Shadowling Soldiers, then you will remember how the Guardian's Dark Vortex would constantly become friendly fire. This will happen again with the new suggestion, but this time the enemies will not have resistance to thier allies' attacks.
Ditto. When playing the battle, the Shadowling guardians didn't attack a single time, possible because they didn't want to friendly-fire their teammate.
That's what the melee attack is for. If they can't hit a lot of units without friendly fire, they can just hit one. Or, they could be placed on the front lines with healers behind them, so they would get in a few attacks without friendly fire.
Quote from: Duckling on November 13, 2010, 03:15:50 PM
Ditto. When playing the battle, the Shadowling guardians didn't attack a single time, possible because they didn't want to friendly-fire their teammate.
Maybe they didn't want to with you, but I know they attacked plenty with me. Just because they don't attack one or two players doesn't mean they won't attack anyone.
The thing is, I played solo on all the battles, and when I didn't, I never grouped my units, so I was just Vengeancing the crud out of the Shadowling soldiers. I don't know exactly how the engine works, but I think they still would have done that even if they had had a single square attack, being in range to use their area.
Quote from: Duckling on November 14, 2010, 10:19:28 AM
The thing is, I played solo on all the battles, and when I didn't, I never grouped my units, so I was just Vengeancing the crud out of the Shadowling soldiers. I don't know exactly how the engine works, but I think they still would have done that even if they had had a single square attack, being in range to use their area.
Can you clarify what you mean by that?
Quote from: Duckling on November 14, 2010, 10:19:28 AM
The thing is, I played solo on all the battles, and when I didn't, I never grouped my units, so I was just Vengeancing the crud out of the Shadowling soldiers. I don't know exactly how the engine works, but I think they still would have done that even if they had had a single square attack, being in range to use their area.
That was TRPG2. The engine is smarter now; they would use their area attacks, and do so wisely. Consider the Fernantus AI- he used Pyro Hail without damaging his units extensively. Obviously, they still do hurt each other, but I think area attacks shouldnt be cut from the game because of this.
Sorry. I was unaware; his units are usually killed off quite a bit before he starts attacking me, so I generally don't deal with the friendly-fire programming. Still, it seems like an overly unwieldly attack for the AI programming to deal with.
This just sounds... unnecessary... unwieldy etc.
It seems the enemy would do as much harm to your enemies as it would do to your teammates unless. The AI could be programmed to where it won't allow that attack to be used if it hits a friendly, but then the attack would almost never be used. In another words, it is a swordsmen with a hammer.
Maybe you could have it with some spirits at the end of the game (I assume that their are angels/spirits of Yawah) as well as Ravinale Guard members; thus it could do some damage to its own teammates, but not as much compared to your teammates.
Yay:
Zackirus
Yogc
Buggy
Mike
Chrono
Cyhper
Maybe:
Dusk
Nay:
Im2smart2u
Duck (Changed his vote to Abstention via Email)
Unless anyone else wants to vote, The Ravinale Sentinel looks to be forumulated
The shadowling guardians had an area of affect attack similar to this one, they used it plenty against me, with minimal friendly fire. And besides, what was the phantom armor aside from a really fancy looking, slow moving, hard hitting swords man in terms of battlefield functionality.
It might have well been a stone golem with higher health/damage
Dusk just emailed me saying he wanted to switch from Maybe to Yay. 7 Yays compared to 1 Nay. Idea being added to formulated
Yay:
Zackirus
Yogc
Buggy
Mike
Chrono
Cyhper
Dusk
Nay:
Im2smart2u
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on November 14, 2010, 10:10:33 PM
This just sounds... unnecessary... unwieldy etc.
sounds like an endorsement?
Quote from: Zackirus on November 14, 2010, 10:35:13 PMNay:
Im2smart2u
Duck (Changed his vote to Abstention via Email)
I think Duck would rather see a bad idea formulated, then agree with me.
This idea has enough votes to be formulated. Whether Craig puts it in the game is his own choice. We might as well move on.
Yogc beat me to it. We need to move on. I have a few ideas swirling around. But I'm going to put them into four categories: Idiotic, Really Bad, Will Probably Get Shot Down, and Stupid.lets see what pops up.
Quote from: yogc elf on November 14, 2010, 11:21:48 PM
This idea has enough votes to be formulated. Whether Craig puts it in the game is his own choice. We might as well move on.
Don't rush this before other people can vote against the idea. It usual for there to be 7 more yays then nays before formulation.
I'm sorry but I need to say this. Can't resist.
MOVE ON. Who else is there to vote? Anyone active? It's childish. I would know.
And you said AGAINST. How do you know that they would say Nay? Maybe they would say Yay.
Umm. I don't know. You might want to put this idea on hold until we know for sure if we acually do go up against Yawah.
After forumlating an enemy without a sensible thought behind it, I thought this is good point to follow KZ and Ertxiem example and leave for awhile. The forums use to be full of smart people who based ideas off of logic and would discuss aspects of the Telepath world. Now it has become full of dumb kids who care more about having thier ideas posted, then actually wanting to improve or understand the game. I have wanted to stop going to this forum for long time because of the gradual increase in dim-wittedness, but continue coming back because of my love for the Telepath games and because going to this forum has become an annoying habit of mine.
Goodbye and good luck
-Clay
Maybe you're right, maybe we are all dumb kids, and we didn't have a sensible reason behind voting yay aside from wanting our work to be put in the game. Or maybe, we decided that we finally came up with an idea that we liked, and idea that we decided fit into a niche that existed in the previous game. Regardless, calling the people on the forum dumb is quite an immature act, and I suspect you did so because you were mad that you didn't get what you wanted.
About the angels, Luca is just pretending to be an angel to play along with the beliefs of the crowd. That doesn't mean there are necessarily angels.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on November 14, 2010, 11:41:25 PM
Umm. I don't know. You might want to put this idea on hold until we know for sure if we acually do go up against Yawah.
I agree. I don't even know what to do with this thread any more.
Agreed, we should wait for more of an idea of the plot before rushing into this formulation.
Very well. Let's wait for an update and resist using this thread. Unless you have an idea that makes solid logical sense, has purpose, and would fit into the Telepath world.
Ranged Healer
Health: 24
Attacks: Long Shield (Damage: 14)
Speed: 3
This unit could heal from rooftops in the city.
Quote from: Duckling on November 21, 2010, 09:42:01 PM
Ranged Healer
Health: 24
Attacks: Long Shield (Damage: 14)
Speed: 3
This unit could heal from rooftops in the city.
I actually kind of like this idea... why didn't you come up with this while im2smart4u was still here?!?! :D
Edit: Aww, what Zackirus below me is saying is true... I liked the idea, though.
Quote from: Duckling on November 21, 2010, 09:42:01 PM
Ranged Healer
Health: 24
Attacks: Long Shield (Damage: 14)
Speed: 3
This unit could heal from rooftops in the city.
Sorry Duckling but the Ravinale Acolyte (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ravinale_Acolyte_%28Enemy%29) or Ravinale Healer (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Ravinale_Healer) already do that job. Good Try though.
Darn! My creative juices are high in pulp today.
Ravinale Citizen
Health: 20
Speed: 3
Psp: N/A
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 4)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
It makes sense, as you have to fight one (Radquies) in Al'al mission. So it would be possible to fight more of these. Also: the people in mission four nearly attacked you, so it is possible that they might try to attack you again. Obviously these enemies serve as swarm units.
(Stats Suggested for Brutal, For Normal: Health: 12 and Damage: 2)
The normal stats of 12 health and 2 damage seem about right. Personally, I think the name should be changed if you were fighting a group of people like the group in mission 4 to maybe Ravinale Cultist of Ravinale Mobster.
???
I would have to vote no on this. Swarm units aren't really well-fitting in a battle engine with room for only 10 units. An area attack could dispatch them too easily.
I think the idea is that they re-spawn if you don't kill them all in time, sort of like the battle outside of the bandit cave. If they appear early in the game, and are spread out among the map, they wouldn't be too bad. If they appeared too late in the game, they would be way too easy.
But the beginning of the game is already done...
Where I think he is talking about is mission four as the people are about to attack you. That would be a good place to have them their. They could also appear in Al'al side mission's which, I am guessing, will take place over the entire game.
I want to vote yes on this but I'm undecided on where they would go. Besides the Al'al sidequest, where would they appear? Maybe in the begger fight as citizens stupidly attempt to aid the guards in apprehending you. Just maybe?
If we can think of more places to put them I'm all for this idea, but how many times will this charachter be needed?
We probably don't know. Let's put this idea on hold for now. I like the concept but is it really needed?
Im2smart4u's PiratesQuoteIn TRPG2, we learn that there are pirates in Cera Bella when we meet Pirate Pete. The use of pirates could be used in missions at Ravinale Docks and missions at Lake Alto.
Pirate Cutlass- they have red bandanas on their heads and cutlass in their right hand.
Health: 26
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 8 )
Pirate Knife Thrower- they have blue bandanas on their heads and a dagger in the right hand.
Health: 18
Speed: 2
Attacks: Fling (Range: 2, Damage: 10)
Counter-attack: Fling (Range: 2, Damage: 10)
Pirate Captain- The Captain has the same hat as Pirate Pete and has two cutlasses; one for each hand.
Health: 80
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage, 8 ), Twin Slash (Range: rightward and leftward arc, Damage: 12)
Counter-attack: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: Mental
Duckling's Shadowling AssassianQuotePsy Assassin (Feedback)
HP: 35
Move: 4
Attacks: Mind Blast (Damage: 10), Feedback (Returns up to: 16)
Resistance: Shadow
Flying
Counter: None
Yays for both (Plenty of other people voted for these as well)
Pirates
Yay
• im2smart4u
• Namelesskitty
• Ert (Except Captain)
• Bugfartboy
• Zackirus
Nay
•N/A
Maybe
•N/A
Shadowling Assassian
Yay
•Buggy
•Duckling
•im2smart4u
•Chrono
•Namelesskitty
•Cypher
•Zackirus
Nay
•N/A
Maybe
•N/A
Yay for shadowling assassin, it has enough to be formulated. Maybe for pirates.
All of them. I'm leaning towards yay, but I'm not sure.
Yay on pirates. I don't think any spriggat patrols will be roaming Lake Alto anymore. So we need an enemy that might appear every so often.
Aye for all.
I am quite for pirates. YArrr!
While we're on the track of civilian characters, might I suggest a protect-the-person
Bartender
HP: 18
Attacks: Melee (Damage: 8); Crossbow 2 (Damage: 12)
Speed: 3
Res. / Immun.: None
If ever there were a barfight with a particularly dangerous person in a side-quest, I would want to protect the bartender, simply to show that civilians' combat role in this game is understated when it comes to protecting their property.
I don't think it's necessary. Nay.
Nay. Thats unecessary.
We need to realize that, short of inventing entirely new sets, there is nothing left to create characters for. And, any new sets we make will most likely not make it into the game, considering how far Craig is in the development.
Maybe the business owner of a particularly rowdy bar would own a crossbow, but not the bartender... a small dagger, maybe. Nay.
Okay, that's it. I'm out of ideas. Except.... there's one more lurking in there.
Which is...
Quote from: Zackirus on November 21, 2010, 10:10:46 PM
Ravinale Citizen
Health: 20
Speed: 3
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 4)
It makes sense, as you have to fight one (Radquies) in Al'al mission. So it would be possible to fight more of these. Also: the people in mission four nearly attacked you, so it is possible that they might try to attack you again. Obviously these enemies serve as swarm units.
I see what you are trying to do, but I don't see the need. Craig has already created two citizen fighters (Radiques (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Radiquesl) and Wadi (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Wadi)). If he wants more citizen fighters then he will just use those enemies' AI and avatar with different names.
I still like the Pirates and the Psy Assassin (Feedback).
I looked at Formulated Enemy Ideas (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=27.msg26551#msg26551) and had a laugh. I suggested the Ghost Healer like six times, but somehow yogc got credit for it. I don't even think yogc voted for the idea, yet he got credit for it.
Hmm... How did that happen? Are you back for good? We need a true old timer here. It's not the same without. And most ideas have died and new ideas have run dry. The Wishlist is beginning to become unneeded.
Shadowling Knife-Flinger (Normal) (They are Purple with small knives on their head)
Health: 37
Speed: 4
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 14) or Knife Throw (Range: 1, Damage: 14), Trick Shot (Range: Backwards L, Damage: 17)
Resistance: Shadow or None
Quote from: Zackirus on November 25, 2010, 01:36:47 PMShadowling Knife-Flinger(They are Purple with small knives on their head)
Health: 37
Speed: 4
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1, Damage: 14) or Knife Throw (Range: 1, Damage: 14), Trick Shot (Range: Backwards L, Damage: 17)
Resistance: Shadow or None
Shadowling Knife-Thrower(They are Red with green bandanas)
Health: 36
Speed: 3
Attacks: Knife Throw (Range: 1, Damage: 10), Fling (Range: 2, Damage: 14), Trick Shot (Range: Backwards L, Damage: 14)
Resistance: Shadow or None
I made some changes.
*Most shadowling soldiers are red instead of purple.
*The green bandana would be better, because it would be piraty and it would be a tribute to Niven.
*I don't see a knife thrower using mind blast.
*A knife thrower shouldn't have assassin level speed, so I lowered it to 3.
Shadowlings are natural Psys. Therefore, I think it needs mindblat.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on November 25, 2010, 05:32:56 PM
Shadowlings are natural Psys. Therefore, I think it needs mindblat.
Did Niven (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Niven#Attacks) use mind blast?
Did Psys like Arman, Rahel, or Griffin use mind blast?
Just because a character is a psy, doesn't mean they use mind blast.
Quote from: Bugfartboy on November 25, 2010, 05:32:56 PM
Shadowlings are natural Psys. Therefore, I think it needs mindblat.
I don't think the Shadowling would choose to throw knives if one of his attacks was Mind Blast.
Why use knife throw if fling works better over the same range? Maybe throw can have range 2 instead, And in that case I suggest switching names. (fling sounds like it would go farther).
I noticed pirates sounded popular, so I thought it only fair to add a counterpart enemy. Thus the ninja. Ninjas are psys who are trained to be like assassins only even more about such things as tricks instead of speed.
The ninja is for later possibly in an arman sidequest?
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Psp: 30
attacks:
shadowport: cost 5
Dagger: damage 12 range 1
Shuriken: damage 9 range 2
Poision shuriken: damage 10 range 2 cost 7 deals backstab on sides or back.
Thoughts, anything I should change or add? Simply approval or disapproval of the idea? All this will be helpful.
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on November 25, 2010, 07:30:02 PM
I noticed pirates sounded popular, so I thought it only fair to add a counterpart enemy. Thus the ninja. Ninjas are psys who are trained to be like assassins only even more about such things as tricks instead of speed.
The ninja is for later possibly in an arman sidequest?
Health: 35
Speed: 3
Psp: 30
attacks:
shadowport: cost 5
Dagger: damage 12 range 1
Shuriken: damage 9 range 2
Poision shuriken: damage 10 range 2 cost 7 deals backstab on sides or back.
Thoughts, anything I should change or add? Simply approval or disapproval of the idea? All this will be helpful.
We've already discussed ninjas, and they were generally not accepted, so, this may be dropped... again.
Now it sounds like you are just making something up Namelesskitty. They don't fit into the Telepath world. Use the brain that God gave you and think through the idea. And please fix your double post.
Quote from: The Holy namelesskitty on November 25, 2010, 07:13:10 PM
Why use knife throw if fling works better over the same range? Maybe throw can have range 2 instead, And in that case I suggest switching names. (fling sounds like it would go farther).
That was a typo. Fling should have a range of 2.
We have already discussed how asain style soldiers don't fit very well in the Telepath world. Please don't make us have this conversation again.
Back to the Shadowling Knife-Thrower:
* Don't you think that some Shadowlings (other than Malis) should be purple, because these Shadowlings are ex-soldiers, don't you think they are a bit older after the Shadow War and they should be purple.
* Do you think they should have Shadow Resistance like most Shadowlings (Niven didn't have it, however).
* I think that Fling should have less attack than Trick Shot almost at 11-13
Quote from: Zackirus on November 26, 2010, 10:41:13 AM* Don't you think that some Shadowlings (other than Malis) should be purple, because these Shadowlings are ex-soldiers, don't you think they are a bit older after the Shadow War and they should be purple.
I don't like the idea of having many purple shadowlings because it takes away some of Malis's uniqueness. Also, from a shadowling's perspective, the Shadow War didn't end that long ago, so ex-soldiers might still be red.
Quote from: Zackirus on November 26, 2010, 10:41:13 AM* Do you think they should have Shadow Resistance like most Shadowlings (Niven didn't have it, however).
I was undecided about shadow resistance for the same reasons you are.
Quote from: Zackirus on November 26, 2010, 10:41:13 AM* I think that Fling should have less attack than Trick Shot almost at 11-13
The stats for Fling (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Fling) and Trick Shot (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Trick_Shot) are the same.
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 26, 2010, 11:50:51 AM
I don't like the idea of having many purple shadowlings because it takes away some of Malis's uniqueness. Also, from a shadowling's perspective, the Shadow War didn't end that long ago, so ex-soldiers might still be red.
* Fine they can be Red with Green Bandannas.
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 26, 2010, 11:50:51 AM
The stats for Fling (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Fling) and Trick Shot (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Trick_Shot) are the same.
* I always thought... nevermind, I guess they can do the same amount of damage.
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 26, 2010, 11:50:51 AM
I was undecided about shadow resistance for the same reasons you are.
Okay What does everyone else think about the resistance of these Shadowlings: None or Shadow (I'm leaning towards None).
Also: The (Feedback) Shadowling (9 Yays) and The Pirates (7 Yays + 1 Maybe) have enough votes to formulated, everyone agree.
Five enemy ideas from the past that got ignored as new ideas came: but received some Yays
[spoiler]
Proctor: (Anon)
Health: 47
Speed: 2
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1 Damage: 17); Feedback (Range: 2, Healing/Damage: 12); Prohibit (Range: 1, Damage: 0) [What is does is it prevents the unit attacked with this move from using any skills/attacks, making it only able move, hold, and end their turn for around 2 turns]
Resistance: None
Blurp: (im2smart4u)
Health: 35
Speed: 2; Leap
Attacks: Tongue Strike (Range: 2, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: None
Frost Assassin: (im2smart4u)
Health: 48 (Flying)
Speed: 4
Attacks: Frost Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 10)
Resistance: Cold
Red Assassin: (im2smart4u)
Health: 42
Speed: 4 (Flying)
Attacks: Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: Heat
Floating Bug (Zackirus)
Health: 32
Speed: 3 (Flying)
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 12), Fire Gush (Range: -1-3 across, Damage: 10)
Resistance: Fire
Immunity: None
Ravinale Sentinel (Zackirus)
Health: 95
Psp: N/A
Speed: 2
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1; Damage: 20), Hammer Stike (Range: 1-2 1-3 Across; Damage: 18)
Resistance: None
Immunity: None
Proctor: I like the enemy but it could use less health and no feedback
Blurp: I think the damage should be raised to 10-12
Red and Frost Assassins: I think they should have less health then their Normal Counterparts and something that sets them apart visually
Floating Bug: I fixed the things people thought what was wrong with it, and in KZ's Question, they are to help the regular Shadow Bugs when they must go outside the deeper downs to forage for food, like in an ant colony, where the winged soldier ants help out the regular ants.
Ravinale Sentinel: Most people thought this enemy was a good idea, and they still think it is, I think that we should come to an agreement about its "Hammer Strike" Attack.
[/spoiler]
Acording to my memory, these are reasons the ideas were pasted.
*Proctor: (rejected for not fitting well enough into the Telepath world)
*Blurp: (got enough votes for forumulation, but no one formulated it)
*Red/Frost Assassin (ignored because people didn't like them, but didn't dislike them enough to vote "nay")
*Floating Bug (rejected for not having a concrete reason to be put in the game)
*Ravinale Sentinel (was popular, but put on hold, because it was decided that it is too early in the game to suggest such an enemy)
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 26, 2010, 04:58:29 PM
Acording to my memory, these are reasons the ideas were pasted.
*Proctor: (rejected for not fitting well enough into the Telepath world)
*Blurp: (got enough votes for forumulation, but no one formulated it)
*Red/Frost Assassin (ignored because people didn't like them, but didn't dislike them enough to vote "nay")
*Floating Bug (rejected for not having a concrete reason to be put in the game)
*Ravinale Sentinel (was popular, but put on hold, because it was decided that it is too early in the game to suggest such an enemy)
Proctor: Nobody Rejected It. In fact, both you(im2smart4u) and Dorgon supported it.
Blurp and Red/Frost Assassins: Well lets have a re-vote then. I have nothing against them
Floating Bug: KZ's question was where does the bug belong? Now What I responded with was, the bug acts like an elite shadow bug (with a bit more flare). Its used is when the shadow bugs have to go out and hunt for food outside of the deeper downs, this bug comes helps them (sort of like flying soldier ants in an ant hill). I think that this explains what that bug is needed for.
Ravinale Sentinel: It can be put on hold.
Everyone don't forgot to vote on the Shadowling Knife-Thrower/Pirate (also included whether or not it should have shadow resistance)
Quote from: Zackirus on November 26, 2010, 05:17:17 PMEveryone don't forgot to vote on the Shadowling Knife-Thrower/Pirate (also included whether or not it should have shadow resistance)
Maybe we should have voted on those before moving back to old ideas.
Re-posting stats for clarity:
Shadowling Knife-Thrower:-(They are Red with green bandannas)
Health: 36
Speed: 3
Attacks: Knife Throw (Range: 1, Damage: 10), Fling (Range: 2, Damage: 14), Trick Shot (Range: Backwards L, Damage: 14)
Resistance: Shadow or None (You can decide)
Thoughts, Ideas, Opinions?
Shadow. Yay. But I would like to see a differed color than red.
I'm thinking this is a bit powerful, but here goes...
Webweaver Nymph
Health: 60 (Brutal; can someone kindly approximate the Normal health?)
Speed: 3
Attacks: Static Shield (Shields for: +8); Mega Shield (Shields for: 18)
Res. / Immun: What Nymphs have.
The idea is a senior nymph that mixes the skill of shielding with the function of webweaving and makes protective "cocoon" shields, thus staying up.
Methinks this is another joining the rejection collection.
Ehh. I don't necessarily like it. But I'll go maybe until is see some discussion on it.
Duckling, can you wait for everyone vote the current enemies on the table before suggesting an idea you think will be rejected?
Yay, for shadowling knife thrower.
Though maybe a different color. Maybe a fuscha color. Burgendy. Something.
Yay for the knife thrower.
@im2smart4u, I am simply surmising, based on my previous track record as far as submissions to takes, that it is quite unlikely that for any particular idea, there will be the general acceptance required for formulation. I don't actually think that it will be rejected; I am simply expressing angst and small amounts of frustration that however long I think an idea out, it is lacking somehow. Anyway, you don't have to consider the idea of the Webweaver Nymph instantly; as this is an informal thread, I figured that it would be a good place to dock an idea until consideration is at hand. Furthermore, I decided that the benefits of not having to save the idea somewhere in a text file so I could remember it would outweigh the small inconvenience of interrupting the flow of a discussion.
And I like the colours of the Knife-flinger/thrower as most recently semi-formally proposed, i.e. red with green bandanas.
Yay knife thrower
Yay:
Zackirus
Bugfartboy
Im2smart4u
Cypher
Namlesskitty
Duckling
Maybe:
Nay:
1-2 More Yays and it will be added to the formulated folks.
Hm... how about an enemy Seer? That would be fearsome... it could, mayhap, transport you back to a bossfight of which you had no choosing. This is probably more of a TRPG4 thing, as it would be a major plot piece... unless Cygnus sees...
No. That fits in no way. Did you think? A battle within a battle. No sense at all. Try to think before posting.
It's not as a battle enemy; it's as a boss that could thrust you into a battle during dialogue; preferably during a monologue.
Quote from: Duckling on November 30, 2010, 09:26:11 PM
Hm... how about an enemy Seer? That would be fearsome... it could, mayhap, transport you back to a bossfight of which you had no choosing. This is probably more of a TRPG4 thing, as it would be a major plot piece... unless Cygnus sees...
These are enemy suggestions, not boss/battle suggestions.
I don't think the program Craig has set up would allow conversation during a battle. And what would make this "Seer" stand out? What would define it as a boss? What abilities would it have to separate it from the rest? And by the way, if you want something similar to Magnilus the Spriggat, don't. Magnilus was and is special.
Yay for knife thrower.
Yay for the Shadolwing Knife thrower, without shadow resistance. It just seems like too many enemies will have shadow resistance, putting those with Shadow affinity at a disadvantage. Also, do you think Craig will be able to code the Trick Shot? It will most likely be fine, but I'd check with him because it could prove difficult.
How would it prove difficult? He merely needs to give the range and the damage does he not? The animation shouldn't be too hard either.
With 8 Yays, and no Nays, the Shadowling Knife Thrower will be added to the formulated enemy ideas.
The four ideas that everyone can vote on.
Proctor: (Anon)
Health: 47
Speed: 2
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1 Damage: 17); Feedback (Range: 2, Healing/Damage: 12); Prohibit (Range: 1, Damage: 0) [What is does is it prevents the unit attacked with this move from using any skills/attacks, making it only able move, hold, and end their turn for around 2 turns]
Resistance: None
Blurp: (im2smart4u)
Health: 35
Speed: 2; Leap
Attacks: Tongue Strike (Range: 2, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: None
Frost Assassin: (im2smart4u)
Health: 48 (Flying)
Speed: 4
Attacks: Frost Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 10)
Resistance: Cold
Red Assassin: (im2smart4u)
Health: 42
Speed: 4 (Flying)
Attacks: Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: Heat
Floating Bug (Zackirus)
Health: 32
Speed: 3 (Flying)
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 12), Fire Gush (Range: -1-3 across, Damage: 10)
Resistance: Fire
Immunity: None
Could you change red assassin's name to maybe fire or pyro? Red assassin just sounds weird when you compare it to Frost assassin. Also, is there any reason all of the Red assassin's stats are inferior to Frost assassins?
I like the idea of the Proctor in general but I don't know how prohibit would work out and I'm not to sure how well it would mesh with the Telepath world. Vote: Maybe
On the Blurp, indont know how well the movement speed would be. Maybe instead of leaping as a single movement, maybe leap could be one of it's abilities but Craig could put a limit on how many times it could use Leap in a turn. I would also like to know where it would apper. Vote: Maybe
As to the Frost/Red Spriggat Assassin I see no flaw with them. Vote: Yay
The flying bug, I don't really think it's necessary. Sorry Zack. Vote: Nay
Ps. You had five enemy ideas up there. Not just four.
Pps. Yogc, when compared to frost spriggats, red spriggats really are somewhat inferior. Look at TRPG2. The Red Spriggat had less health than the frost and if memory serves they did less damage.
What is the proctor supposed to be, anyways?
Blurp: If leap is only allowed to be used once a turn, yay.
Frost/Red Assassins: Red Assassin still sounds a little weird to me, but since they are red spriggats, I guess it would be even weirder to change the name. I vote yay.
Flying Bug- I'm not too sure about the fire gush attack; no bugs as of yet have demonstrated a heat affinity. Maybe you could change the attack to an acid spray and remove the heat resistance.
Quote from: Zackirus on November 30, 2010, 10:22:07 PM
With 8 Yays, and no Nays, the Shadowling Knife Thrower will be added to the formulated enemy ideas.
The four ideas that everyone can vote on.
Proctor: (Anon)
Health: 47
Speed: 2
Attacks: Mind Blast (Range: 1 Damage: 17); Feedback (Range: 2, Healing/Damage: 12); Prohibit (Range: 1, Damage: 0) [What is does is it prevents the unit attacked with this move from using any skills/attacks, making it only able move, hold, and end their turn for around 2 turns]
Resistance: None
Blurp: (im2smart4u)
Health: 35
Speed: 2; Leap
Attacks: Tongue Strike (Range: 2, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: None
Frost Assassin: (im2smart4u)
Health: 48 (Flying)
Speed: 4
Attacks: Frost Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 10)
Resistance: Cold
Red Assassin: (im2smart4u)
Health: 42
Speed: 4 (Flying)
Attacks: Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: Heat
Floating Bug (Zackirus)
Health: 32
Speed: 3 (Flying)
PsP: 0
Attacks: Melee (Range: 1, Damage: 12), Fire Gush (Range: -1-3 across, Damage: 10)
Resistance: Fire
Immunity: None
Im for the Frost and Red assassins, but not the others.
The flying bug is not well explained as far as how they can fly, and even if it were, it doesn't seem necessary. Not all enemy sets need a flying type foe.
The Blurp is a fine idea, but adds nothing new and doesn't seem to fit into any existing sets of enemies. Maybe I missed this information somewhere, but it doesn't seem to have a place to fit.
The Protector would be hard to code, requiring a new attack that the enemy wouldn't know how to prioritize.
It's a Proctor, and yes, I agree.
I also agree, too complicated with the Proctor with that one attack.
I concur, the complication is too much.
QuoteThe flying bug is not well explained as far as how they can fly, and even if it were, it doesn't seem necessary. Not all enemy sets need a flying type foe.
I think the flying bug is just a beetle, and flies like a normal beetle would.
Red Assassin: Does everyone want to change their name to Heat Assassin. Also: We should change the skills so that (at normal) they are weaker then their normal counterparts.
Frost Assassin:
Health: 38 (Flying)
Speed: 4
Attacks: Frost Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 10)
Resistance: Cold
Heat Assassin:
Health: 32
Speed: 4 (Flying)
Attacks: Fire Breath (Range: 1-2, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: Heat
The Blurp's speed can be explained lower.
Blurp:
Health: 35
Speed: 1; Leap (What This means it that it moves 1 and has a leap move or vise versa)
Attacks: Tongue Strike (Range: 2, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: None
The Proctor and Floating Bug is is not well liked so, they will be dropped.
Quote from: im2smart4u on November 14, 2010, 11:57:57 PM
After forumlating an enemy without a sensible thought behind it, I thought this is good point to follow KZ and Ertxiem example and leave for awhile. The forums use to be full of smart people who based ideas off of logic and would discuss aspects of the Telepath world. Now it has become full of dumb kids who care more about having thier ideas posted, then actually wanting to improve or understand the game. I have wanted to stop going to this forum for long time because of the gradual increase in dim-wittedness, but continue coming back because of my love for the Telepath games and because going to this forum has become an annoying habit of mine.
Goodbye and good luck
-Clay
Once again, :'(
Quote from: MikeW781 on December 01, 2010, 06:01:34 PM
The Blurp is a fine idea, but adds nothing new and doesn't seem to fit into any existing sets of enemies. Maybe I missed this information somewhere, but it doesn't seem to have a place to fit.
If there was only some great forest in Cera Bella where animals enemies like Blurps would fit in.
I am not a big fan of the Frost/Red Assassin, Proctor, and Floating Bug.
Yes, I know I was the one who suggested the spriggat assassins.
Quote from: Zackirus on December 02, 2010, 08:26:27 PM
The Blurp's speed can be explained lower.
Blurp:
Health: 35
Speed: 1; Leap (What This means it that it moves 1 and has a leap move or vise versa)
Attacks: Tongue Strike (Range: 2, Damage: 8 )
Resistance: None
For some reason, I am reminded of Fleeches (http://oddworldlibrary.net/toe/Fleeches). You know, from Oddworld?
Quote from: im2smart4u on December 03, 2010, 05:16:01 PM
Quote from: MikeW781 on December 01, 2010, 06:01:34 PM
The Blurp is a fine idea, but adds nothing new and doesn't seem to fit into any existing sets of enemies. Maybe I missed this information somewhere, but it doesn't seem to have a place to fit.
If there was only some great forest in Cera Bella where animals enemies like Blurps would fit in.
a giant toad living in in the forest? i would think the Hero would have noticed that in TRPG2, and it also sounds kinda ridiculus. fighting things like giant toads is unoriginal, and not backed up by any sort of story.
Quote from: MikeW781 on December 03, 2010, 06:51:34 PMQuote from: im2smart4u on December 03, 2010, 05:16:01 PMQuote from: MikeW781 on December 01, 2010, 06:01:34 PM
The Blurp is a fine idea, but adds nothing new and doesn't seem to fit into any existing sets of enemies. Maybe I missed this information somewhere, but it doesn't seem to have a place to fit.
If there was only some great forest in Cera Bella where animals enemies like Blurps would fit in.
a giant toad living in in the forest? i would think the Hero would have noticed that in TRPG2, and it also sounds kinda ridiculus. fighting things like giant toads is unoriginal, and not backed up by any sort of story.
*You can go into the woods and not see a bear, so why can't you go into the woods and not see a blurp.
*Is it that strange that the TRPG2 Hero didn't see a blurp when he only saw one wood-folk?
*There isn't a need for a background story for wild animal attacks (like bug attacks in TRPG2 and TSoG), but if you need one then here it is: Wood-Folk send their pets to attack humans in their territory.
Quote from: im2smart4u on December 03, 2010, 08:16:27 PM
Quote from: MikeW781 on December 03, 2010, 06:51:34 PMQuote from: im2smart4u on December 03, 2010, 05:16:01 PMQuote from: MikeW781 on December 01, 2010, 06:01:34 PM
The Blurp is a fine idea, but adds nothing new and doesn't seem to fit into any existing sets of enemies. Maybe I missed this information somewhere, but it doesn't seem to have a place to fit.
If there was only some great forest in Cera Bella where animals enemies like Blurps would fit in.
a giant toad living in in the forest? i would think the Hero would have noticed that in TRPG2, and it also sounds kinda ridiculus. fighting things like giant toads is unoriginal, and not backed up by any sort of story.
*You can go into the woods and not see a bear, so why can't you go into the woods and not see a blurp.
*Is it that strange that the TRPG2 Hero didn't see a blurp when he only saw one wood-folk?
*There isn't a need for a background story for wild animal attacks (like bug attacks in TRPG2 and TSoG), but if you need one then here it is: Wood-Folk send their pets to attack humans in their territory.
Okay, I'll accept that.
Quote from: im2smart4u on December 03, 2010, 08:16:27 PM
Quote from: MikeW781 on December 03, 2010, 06:51:34 PMQuote from: im2smart4u on December 03, 2010, 05:16:01 PMQuote from: MikeW781 on December 01, 2010, 06:01:34 PM
The Blurp is a fine idea, but adds nothing new and doesn't seem to fit into any existing sets of enemies. Maybe I missed this information somewhere, but it doesn't seem to have a place to fit.
If there was only some great forest in Cera Bella where animals enemies like Blurps would fit in.
a giant toad living in in the forest? i would think the Hero would have noticed that in TRPG2, and it also sounds kinda ridiculus. fighting things like giant toads is unoriginal, and not backed up by any sort of story.
*You can go into the woods and not see a bear, so why can't you go into the woods and not see a blurp.
*Is it that strange that the TRPG2 Hero didn't see a blurp when he only saw one wood-folk?
*There isn't a need for a background story for wild animal attacks (like bug attacks in TRPG2 and TSoG), but if you need one then here it is: Wood-Folk send their pets to attack humans in their territory.
You're back, yay!
Frost/Heat Assassins
Yay
Zackirus
Bugfartboy
MikeW781
Nay
im2smart4u
Maybe
N/A
Blurps
Yay
Zackirus
Bugfartboy
MikeW781
im2smart4u
Nay
N/A
Maybe
N/A
For blurp, yay.
For assasins, nay.
Blurps yay.
Undecided on assassins.
I am not a "Nay" for Frost/Red Assassins, I just don't like it enough for a "Yay".
Quote from: im2smart4u on December 04, 2010, 01:44:45 PM
I am not a "Nay" for Frost/Red Assassins, I just don't like it enough for a "Yay".
Are their any ways that we could change it to get it to a Yay? What if they would have a range 1-3 across like attack, after all the breath can be changed...
OOOOO
OXXXO
OOROO
OOOOO
What about this sort of attack.
Yay for assassins, maybe for blurps, wouldn't the croaking of giant toads/frogs be more audible and hard not to notice?
Nay to assassins, Yay to Blurps.
Frost/Heat Assassins
Yay
Zackirus
MikeW781
The Holy Namelesskitty
Nay
Steelfist
Maybe
Duckling
Cypher
Bugfartboy
Blurps
Yay
Zackirus
Bugfartboy
MikeW781
im2smart4u
Cypher
Duckling
Steelfist
Nay
N/A
Maybe
The Holy namelesskitty
No need to keep on voting for the blurps, they're already on the formulated thread.
Stalker
A monstrosity created by the mechanics to be an elite assassin. Part man, Part golem, it moves with terrifying speed and strikes with awesome power. Possibly a boss.
Stats
Health: 340
Speed: 8 (I know, I know, the speed's very high, but I'm sure you can appreciate why)
Attacks: Perhaps a selection of attacks from golems and assassins?
Resistance: Physical.
Obviously, the stats can be revised.
Nay. Craig will not implement such a major story line change this late in the game making process. I appreciate the idea, but wether or not it is formulated, Craig will most likely not use it.
Nay. I agree with Mike, and even if a boss, it seems far too overpowered, this thing would be more powerful than Tastidian, and pretty close to Nelis' power from TRPG2.
Update: Buggy has sent me a message asking me to state that his vote on the Stalker is a Nay.
To quote him,
Quote from: Bugfartboy on December 05, 2010, 04:56:55 PM
Would you please state that my vote on the newly suggested enemy idea is a nay?
Quote from: Duskling on December 05, 2010, 04:48:22 PM
Update: Buggy has sent me a message asking me to state that his vote on the Stalker is a Nay.
To quote him,
Quote from: Bugfartboy on December 05, 2010, 04:56:55 PM
Would you please state that my vote on the newly suggested enemy idea is a nay?
Why would he do that? Instead of sharing it here?
No idea, but it's true.
Update: Buggy notified me as to why he wants me to post for him: he's attempting not to post... for whatever reason.
Fair 'nuff. It occured to me, so I posted it, before I forgot.
Nay for the stalker.
Considering we saw 3 frost spriggat assassins in TRPG 2, I think it would make sense to see some spriggat assassins in TSoG. Yay for assassins.
Bug Empress:
Health: 180
Speed:0
Attacks: Melee (Damage:24), Spit (Damage:15, Range: 2)
Counterattack: Melee (Dam:24)
Immunity: Shadow
An ancient bug queen has grown to be massive, in size and in power (Approx: double bug queen's size).
A good crypt boss?
Why would we need a Bug Empress when there is already a Bug Queen?
Why do we need void bugs when we already have shadow bugs? It's just a better version, and a small expansion of the shadow bug set.
Quote from: Steelfist on December 28, 2010, 09:34:35 PMWhy do we need void bugs when we already have shadow bugs? It's just a better version, and a small expansion of the shadow bug set.
Frankly, I don't see the need for void bugs, since we are probably not going to fight the bug fraction in an early mission and a late mission. But that is beside the point. To take the boss bug from TRPG2 and double the size is a lame idea. Plus, bug queens are in nature so they make sense in the games, while a bug empress is not anything, but a mistaken idea that insects operate like a monarchy.
It's simply a larger, older, queen. It's not a different creature; it only has a different name to signify it's greater power.
Quote from: Steelfist on December 30, 2010, 06:50:40 PM
It's simply a larger, older, queen. It's not a different creature; it only has a different name to signify it's greater power.
Larger? Should we really have an enemy that is more then four squares?
Perhaps not, though I think that that is a rather weak argument. Do we need any new enemies at all? Of course not! We don't need any! The game could have still been excellent with a simple rework of existing enemies. Should we have one? That is a matter of opinion, no?
The bug queen had to be unmovable in TRPG2 to prevent it from being too cheap. The bug empress a bit much. I'm not sure if it would be difficult to fight or too cramped to do anything.
Quote from: im2smart4u on June 14, 2010, 12:44:23 PM
Quote from: yogc on June 13, 2010, 01:34:24 PM
Maybe there could be a cult boss that had a similar or same move set as Zem the reaper. After all, isn't the Jinn Ilbis supposed to be the same as a boss in Telepath Psy Arena 2? Maybe General D'Kah could have Zem's attacks. Since he would probably be one of the later bosses, he wouldn't have to be powered down that much.
Zem the Reaper needs to be unique, so TPA2 is unique. I think Craig said D'Kah will be armed with a poleaxe.
So what was your "New Enemy Ideas"?
I don't understand what a poleaxe is. A check on Cambridge dictionary revealed that its an adjective, not a noun.
poleaxe
noun
°an ax having both a blade and a hammer face; used to slaughter cattle.
°a long-handled battle-ax, being a combination of ax, hammer and pike.
verb
°to fell someone with, or as if with, a poleaxe.
*D'Kah is going to have a poleaxe which will be unique to him.
*I think Craig has already planned out all the Ravinale Guard enemies that he is going to use, so Ravinale Tanks are a useless suggestion
*I though everyone agreed that we were done with needless suggestions?
You know, were somebody merely to view your recent posts, they would have difficulty distinguishing you from a 'troll'. There is no need to post, or even to read the posts, if you feel that all suggestions are, at this stage, pointless.
As for the guardsman, I'm afraid it probably would be redundant, and it doesn't quite fit in.
At whom was that directed? TG? If so, I agree. And we all did agree to leave the rest of the game to Craig. Enough is enough TG.
Why don't we just call it quits on this page since most of us are sure that Craig has everything planned out. Nothing else posted here will be formulated, so let's just spend our time posting elsewhere.
That's want we've been saying. End of Discussion.
One more thing. It may be a bit vague, but it's something I'd like to see implemented. It would be nice to see a later enemy in the game that was not affected by backstab damage at all, like Cygnus (because of his all-awareness) or Iblis (because he's a rock). Just an idea I'd like to throw out there.
Or an enemy that was programmed to protect a boss at all costs, and cover the boss's back. This would also be equally satisfying, but I think the former would be easier, seeing as battlefield objects already don't take backstab damage.
Just tossing the idea out, would anyone else like to see a psy golem?
Honestly, it's a bit late for that. :(
Not to mention we've already discussed that.