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Games => TSoG => TSoG Wish List => Topic started by: SmartyPants on April 03, 2010, 05:19:30 PM

Title: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on April 03, 2010, 05:19:30 PM
(http://s8.postimage.org/crzb4095h/Shadowling_Aging_3.png) (http://postimage.org/)
The current colors are red, purple, blue, and green. Young Shadowlings are RED; then when they become middle age they turn  PURPLE; after passing the "midlife crisis" period, they turn BLUE; when Shadowlings become very old they turn GREEN.  When the Shadowlings become very power they glow WHITE.
(http://s2.postimage.org/13QFi.png) (http://www.postimage.org/)
If the color wheel shows age, then I have two suggestions for yellow and orange.  When Shadowlings are newborns they are an ORANGE color and they turn red during puberty.  When green Shadowlings are dying of old age, they turn YELLOW.

(http://s11.postimage.org/p4f41eyjz/Shadowling_Orange.png) (http://postimage.org/) => (http://s10.postimage.org/l7113hqhx/Shadowling_Red.png) (http://postimage.org/) => (http://s7.postimage.org/njdau4pvb/Shadowling_Purple.png) (http://postimage.org/) =>

(http://s9.postimage.org/absiy2aiz/Shadowling_Blue.png) (http://postimage.org/) => (http://s11.postimage.org/sgi08gfov/Shadowling_Green.png) (http://postimage.org/) => (http://s7.postimage.org/rfv83v08n/Shadowling_Yellow.png) (http://postimage.org/)
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Xemadus Echina on April 03, 2010, 06:41:08 PM
The only reason you should have yellow is if the shadowling really is dead.  Otherwise it could get confused with orange.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on April 03, 2010, 07:00:42 PM
To complete the color wheel of shadowling aging (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Shadowling#Aging), I came up with two ideas:
*An orange shadowling complains that all his friends have turned red and he hasn't.  The Hero then can give him advice on puberty or chose to make fun of him.
*On her death bed, a yellow Lala asks for the Hero to perform a last request(side quest) before she dies.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Zhampir on April 04, 2010, 01:25:43 AM
I'd rather yellow be new-born to child, and orange be "teenage", dead would be nothing, so a "dying" one should be fading, that's of course assuming that shadowlings can die of old age.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on April 04, 2010, 08:07:38 AM
If shadowling coundn't die of old age then there would be numerous green shadowlings and few red.  When old age kills, a new generation of old people replace the last, but when old age doesn't kill, then the old generation is joined by the new generation to create a massive number of old people.  Since the TRPG2 Hero has witnessed few green shadowlings, it can easily be concluded that shadowlings die of old age.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Zhampir on April 07, 2010, 04:28:44 PM
It can? Shadowlings live for a very long time, perhaps indefinitely, perhaps "glowing" more over time until they have an all white glow and their age can no-longer be determined. Besides that, look at the elderly in our world. Specifically America. I see them every where. You're logic of not seeing them doesn't make much sense to me.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on April 07, 2010, 04:53:20 PM
It can? Shadowlings live for a very long time, perhaps indefinitely, perhaps "glowing" more over time until they have an all white glow and their age can no-longer be determined. Besides that, look at the elderly in our world. Specifically America. I see them every where. You're logic of not seeing them doesn't make much sense to me.
So image that humans are immortal.  Grandparents don't die, yet you parents continue to become older.  Now there are two generations of old people.  Those two generations of old people don't die, yet you and me become old.  Now there are three generations of old people who outnumber our kid's generation three to one. The generation after our kids will be outnumbered 4 to 1.  And the generation after that will be outnumber 5 to 1. And the generation after that will be outnumber 6 to 1....est.

If Shadowlings are immortal, then in a hundred generations, green shadowlings will outnumber red shadowlings 100 to 1.  Since Lala is the only green shadowling seen by the Hero, it is not possible for shadowlings to be immortal.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Ertxiem on April 07, 2010, 05:27:37 PM
I agree that shadowlings don't seem to be immortal, although I believe that it was discussed in the old forums that their life span is larger than the life span of humans.

[...]
Since Lala is the only green shadowling, it is not possible for shadowlings to be immortal.
However, the above argument has some flaws:
- We only saw Lala, but there could be more green shadowlings occupying relevant positions in the shadowling empire in places that wouldn't be accessible to slaves or;
- Most green shadowlings died in the shadow wars (for example, in regular combat or in a despicable action by the enemies of the shadowlings) - it might even happen that the death of the older shadowlings in combat brought the necessity of using slaves in battle.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Xemadus Echina on April 07, 2010, 07:20:50 PM
warning, may contain sarcasm
Spoiler
heres a little dose of realism:  The reason why there were no more green shadowlings in TRPG2 is because Craig had no use for putting any more in.  Voila problem solved ;)
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Zhampir on April 07, 2010, 07:37:48 PM
If you apply that logic "because the creator said so" to every thing, then what's the point of asking? God will provide all? Such an idea is rather unimaginative. Perhaps all the "seniors" live in senior homes?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Dorgon 5000 on April 07, 2010, 10:22:49 PM
If you apply that logic "because the creator said so" to every thing, then what's the point of asking? God will provide all? Such an idea is rather unimaginative. Perhaps all the "seniors" live in senior homes?

It canīt be so that they put them in senior homes. They say that aging is much more pleasant for shadowling than for humans.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Zhampir on April 08, 2010, 03:13:02 PM
So it's not possible that the older shadowlings tend to stick with their generation somewhere? We seem to have a very small window into Cera Bella, judging by the proportions of lake alto, your  boat, the academy, and other things in correlation with the main map. There's still a whole world out there to explore.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Duskling on April 24, 2010, 10:28:40 AM
I will have to say that, if yellow means that the Shadowling is dying of old age, what point will there be to that Shadowling? I suppose you could do something of a "Final Request" side quest, but you can't face it in battle since it is too old, and, other than the side quest idea, there is nothing to talk about if you find it on the street of Somnus and whatnot. However, there may be numerous side quests to these Shadowlings, since they may have sent a loved one someplace and not heard from him/her since, or an old enemy they want exterminated before they die. As we can see there are plenty of things to do with these Shadowlings if the Creator decides to place them ingame, that is only an if, mind you.

Now we come to the orange Shadowlings, personally, I would love to see more of the arrogant Darkling types, only younger and even more arrogant. But, what function will they have ingame? They can't all be side quest givers, perhaps a teammate, but overall not the best choice to put in the game.

My synopsis is that the choice of Shadowlings that the Creator has already created should stay the same, seeing how these Shadowlings might be neither useful nor, to some players, even intresting.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on April 24, 2010, 02:09:31 PM
I will have to say that, if yellow means that the Shadowling is dying of old age, what point will there be to that Shadowling? I suppose you could do something of a "Final Request" side quest, but you can't face it in battle since it is too old, and, other than the side quest idea, there is nothing to talk about if you find it on the street of Somnus and whatnot.
Couldn't you say the same thing about TRPG2's green shadowling, Lala?

Now we come to the orange Shadowlings, personally, I would love to see more of the arrogant Darkling types, only younger and even more arrogant. But, what function will they have ingame? They can't all be side quest givers, perhaps a teammate, but overall not the best choice to put in the game.
Does he have to be any different than Snarl or Nightling?  He would give the character some perseptive on shadowling life or provide a laugh.  Not everything is a big grand quest.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Duskling on April 24, 2010, 05:25:39 PM
I will have to say that, if yellow means that the Shadowling is dying of old age, what point will there be to that Shadowling? I suppose you could do something of a "Final Request" side quest, but you can't face it in battle since it is too old, and, other than the side quest idea, there is nothing to talk about if you find it on the street of Somnus and whatnot.
Couldn't you say the same thing about TRPG2's green shadowling, Lala?
Well, she wasn't exactly dying of old age, now was she?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on April 24, 2010, 07:38:25 PM
I will have to say that, if yellow means that the Shadowling is dying of old age, what point will there be to that Shadowling? I suppose you could do something of a "Final Request" side quest, but you can't face it in battle since it is too old, and, other than the side quest idea, there is nothing to talk about if you find it on the street of Somnus and whatnot.
Couldn't you say the same thing about TRPG2's green shadowling, Lala?
Well, she wasn't exactly dying of old age, now was she?
I don't understand what point you are trying to make?  Do you think people are worthless, when they become old, so they aren't worth talking to?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Xemadus Echina on April 25, 2010, 10:56:22 AM
I have an idea.  What happens is when shadowlings get older their psy capabilities exceed their bodies capacity.  This causes them to start emitting a longer wavelength of light.

Here's another idea as well.  The longer the wavelength a shadowling has for it's coloring, the less control it has over the full extents of it's power.  This is why shadowlings go from red (longer wavelength) to purple(shorter wavelength) when they hit middle age since it's like how human brains become fully developed in our 20's.  This also explains why shadowlings become green later in life since green is a longer wavelength then purple.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on April 25, 2010, 02:51:34 PM
when they hit middle age since it's like how human brains become fully developed in our 20's.
What third world country are you from where 20s is middle age?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Duskling on April 25, 2010, 05:36:31 PM
I will have to say that, if yellow means that the Shadowling is dying of old age, what point will there be to that Shadowling? I suppose you could do something of a "Final Request" side quest, but you can't face it in battle since it is too old, and, other than the side quest idea, there is nothing to talk about if you find it on the street of Somnus and whatnot.
Couldn't you say the same thing about TRPG2's green shadowling, Lala?
Well, she wasn't exactly dying of old age, now was she?
I don't understand what point you are trying to make?  Do you think people are worthless, when they become old, so they aren't worth talking to?
Ummm, you said they are dying of old age when they are yellow, not just old, but dying of old age. If they are dying of old age, then maybe, as I said, they may have some final requests, words of wisdom, or a clue, but, other than that, it just doesn't fit in.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on May 02, 2010, 08:18:15 AM
I will have to say that, if yellow means that the Shadowling is dying of old age, what point will there be to that Shadowling? I suppose you could do something of a "Final Request" side quest, but you can't face it in battle since it is too old, and, other than the side quest idea, there is nothing to talk about if you find it on the street of Somnus and whatnot.
Couldn't you say the same thing about TRPG2's green shadowling, Lala?
Well, she wasn't exactly dying of old age, now was she?
I don't understand what point you are trying to make?  Do you think people are worthless, when they become old, so they aren't worth talking to?
Ummm, you said they are dying of old age when they are yellow, not just old, but dying of old age. If they are dying of old age, then maybe, as I said, they may have some final requests, words of wisdom, or a clue, but, other than that, it just doesn't fit in.
I am glad you are not might grand kid.  I wouldn't want someone not talking to me just because my time left on earth is short.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Duskling on May 04, 2010, 11:11:18 PM
I am glad you are not might grand kid.  I wouldn't want someone not talking to me just because my time left on earth is short.
Alright, I give up, you win, but I still think that a Shadowling dying of old age may be a bit out of place in the TRPG universe, not sure why, though.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Zhampir on May 12, 2010, 06:51:34 PM
I agree with Duskling, what could possibly kill a shadow? They are shadowlings, born from the darkness, weak to the light. I think shadowlings either transcend, simply go to a "retirement home", or must be subjected to a violent death. I don't really see shadows dieing of old age. They seem more like ghosts than mortals anyways.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on May 13, 2010, 01:46:43 PM
I agree with Duskling, what could possibly kill a shadow? They are shadowlings, born from the darkness, weak to the light. I think shadowlings either transcend, simply go to a "retirement home", or must be subjected to a violent death. I don't really see shadows dieing of old age. They seem more like ghosts than mortals anyways.
But they are mortal, since shadowlings die when they are defeated, while spirits disipate temporarily (http://sinisterdesign.net/forum/index.php?topic=76.0) when defeated.  Like all mortals, shadowlngs will die of old age.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: FlyingFinn on May 27, 2010, 07:10:02 AM
Quote
But they are mortal, since shadowlings die when they are defeated, while spirits disipate temporarily when defeated.  Like all mortals, shadowlngs will die of old age
True, but we donīt know enough about biology of shadowlings to say that (DO they have biology? They call humans fleshlings, which gives image that they arenīt flesh creatures. On the other hand, they "donīt sprout from magic beans", they have families.). But I think that they live longer than humans, anyway.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on May 29, 2010, 07:38:45 AM
Quote
But they are mortal, since shadowlings die when they are defeated, while spirits disipate temporarily when defeated.  Like all mortals, shadowlngs will die of old age
True, but we donīt know enough about biology of shadowlings to say that (DO they have biology? They call humans fleshlings, which gives image that they arenīt flesh creatures. On the other hand, they "donīt sprout from magic beans", they have families.). But I think that they live longer than humans, anyway.
I agree that they live longer, but I don't think shadowlings live forever.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: cyso on June 03, 2010, 03:09:54 PM
Lala mentioned that shadowlings age. This seems to infer that they eventually, like any other creature, grow old and weak, and eventually die. I do think that they live a really long time and grow old at different rates. If the queen was referred to as a deity, then I doubt anyone remembers when she was born, even Lala. However, the queen isn't even green yet.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Duskling on June 03, 2010, 03:35:04 PM
I'm back, and with an arguement! Lala said that Shadowlings "green" as they age, if this is true, then if they are dying of old age they must be a swamp-colored color, and when they die, they're either yellow, like a totally different color than when they started, or black, the color of death.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: cyso on June 03, 2010, 04:08:26 PM
If you look at the color wheel on the wiki, you will notice that from red, turns purple, then blue, then green, then yellow. If shadowlings are old, but not dying, at the color of green, then the next color ought to be yellow according to the color wheel. However, I do think that when a shadowling dies, their glow fades, and they may appear dark or even black.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Duskling on June 03, 2010, 04:13:55 PM
That is what I think, but it looks like, on the color wheel, that they are either yellow when they are dying of old age, as I said, I don't see that fitting in with TRPG, or when they are infants, what with it being at the top of the wheel, also being the shortest age period. Also, it says that they "start out red" and they "finally turn green," which implies that orange and yellow were most likely just ignored, or didn't seem likely in the TRPG universe.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: cyso on June 03, 2010, 04:21:04 PM
Keep in mind, green is old but not dying. The next color is yellow. It makes sense if that is dying. As for yellow being at the top of the wheel, keep in mind that the only rules we have about where to start on the wheel is that red is before purple, purple is before blue, blue is before green, and green is near the end. The order of orange and yellow is a little hard to determine. I would like to think that shadowlings start orange and end yellow since that goes with the "rules" stated above.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Duskling on June 03, 2010, 04:23:21 PM
Alas, I' am bested and silenced once more, but I'll be back...
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on June 03, 2010, 04:36:18 PM
Also, it says that they "start out red" and they "finally turn green," which implies that orange and yellow were most likely just ignored, or didn't seem likely in the TRPG universe.
The wiki only includes current canon, so speculation about orange and yellow won't be included in the article.
For example: The color purple wasn't in the wiki until the appearance of Malis.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on June 11, 2010, 07:28:03 AM
I think it would be cool to make Carrion (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Carrion) orange since he is younger then most shadowlings.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: KZ on June 24, 2010, 05:48:49 PM
Just to point out, folks, that the colour wheel wasn't much of a discussion point in the olden days- and I am not sure why it was put up on the wiki in the first place, as most theories about Shadowling colour revolved around their age and the energies related to the emitted wavelengths (hence- colour), and not much was siad in terms of looking at age and colour from point of view of art. So I don't think the absent parts of the wheel are that important. However, given that "yellowing" upon death would equate to having lower energies, it sort of fits in, yet it also implies that a dying old Shadowling is more powerful than a young red one! Which doesn't make much sense, really! Plus, I doubt we'll get to see much of newborn or dying Shadowlings (from old age, that is). It's also a good question of how do Shadowlings die of old age? Given the idea of Shadowling anatomy from the old forums, methinks they'll explode like stars and dissapear in a whiff of dark smoke (ie like the "plume" Malis mentions), when they no longer can or care to control with their Psy power the raw energy within them.
On the point of Shadowling immirtality, I think it's pretty clear that they are very mortal indeed (take, for instance, Nelis, who was considered unique and immortal by Shadowlings, suggesting that they are quite mortal; think of Lala, who talks about getting older, which does imply, quite clearly, eventual passing from the material plane).

I, for one, would like to see some light shed on what other appendices, like the horns, can Shadowlings obtain? (Presumably, they'll also be bones?)
After all, the colour idea has been discussed quite a bit, but those horns (as Craig said- some Shadowlings simply get them, not an indication of power or status or age), though random, do allow room for creativity...
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on July 02, 2010, 09:45:32 AM
I don't understand why you think the "emitted wavelengths" would make shadowlings more powerful.  The Light element deals with electromagnetic radiation or "emitted wavelengths", while the Shadowlings' Shadow element deals with physical forms of negative emotions.  The color wouldn't effect a shadowlings power because shadowlings don't use the Light element (Tastidian and Nelis being the exception).

I also thought of a better theory to explain Nelis and Tastidian's color.  Since spirits are made of pure psy energy and the spirits are completly white, then raw psy energy is white.  Therefore the massive amount of psy energy in the Shadowling Queen and Tastidian causes them to glow white.


Sorry KZ, but the poll shows that most people want to see more shadowling colors
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: KZ on July 02, 2010, 03:27:23 PM
Interesting way of looking at it, but the nature of the Shadowling may have nothing to do with their ability to manipulate an element- for instance, although humans are mostly water, it doesn't mean we can freeze it or heat it up or manipulate it much on our own free will. Thus, these two points are not mutually exclusive.

Mmm, that theory has been around for quite some time, im2smart4u, for about two years, about the high amount of raw Psy energy causing Nelis and Tastidian to glow white. The only extra bit is the connection to the Spirits, which is quite neat, methinks.

It's fine by me, as long as those colours are fitted and explained away nicely, I don't see why not. Question is wherether Craig would have the time or desire to see them added in.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on July 02, 2010, 05:36:24 PM
Since not everyone likes the yellowing while nearing death idea, does anyone have a better idea for including a yellow shadowling?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Bromtaghon on July 02, 2010, 05:57:56 PM
Genetic experiment?
Over-exposure to sunlight?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Zackirus on July 02, 2010, 07:41:41 PM
Genetic experiment?

As Barzul's story suggests: the experiment to give shadowlings the ability to control light. I don't think however Craig would use that idea as the main focus right now is the situation in Ravinville and not Somnus.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Duskling on July 02, 2010, 07:45:13 PM
How about a Shadowling that took a direct Light Blast and survived?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Zackirus on July 02, 2010, 07:48:50 PM
That sounds impropable as the many people might have survived a direct elemental attack but they didn't devolp those elemental attacks...
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Duskling on July 02, 2010, 08:07:08 PM
I mean that the EMP in the blast was strong enough to alter his/her DNA to make him yellow, but not so to make him fluent in Light attacks, I mean, a Shadowling with a Light attack would be ridiculous.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Bromtaghon on July 02, 2010, 10:09:10 PM
*cough*Nelis*cough*
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Zhampir on July 02, 2010, 10:51:20 PM
Yes but Nelis' control of light based attacks comes from the amount of psy power dwelling inside of her.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Bromtaghon on July 02, 2010, 11:01:05 PM
Does it? I've never heard any official confirmation about where her power comes from.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Zhampir on July 02, 2010, 11:08:18 PM
There's never any confirmation about stuff like this, only speculation. Unless of course, the divine creator and master, Craig Stern, decides to use his powers of divine intervention to enlighten his devout followers.^^
Totally not kissing up -----^
XD
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on July 03, 2010, 08:20:03 AM
I mean that the EMP in the blast was strong enough to alter his/her DNA to make him yellow, but not so to make him fluent in Light attacks, I mean, a Shadowling with a Light attack would be ridiculous.
According to you and my time playing TPA2, tons of shadowlings should also have altered DNA.  I play with alot of shadowlings and they all took alot of light attacks.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: KZ on July 03, 2010, 08:41:47 AM
I don't really see any good place for yellow colour (hence my not being too keen on this idea). However, what of newborn shadowlings, if the folks are so desirious of getting in a new colour, why not give one to a newborn Shadowling- that might cast light on some interesting aspect of the Shadowling society, possibly provide a side-quest, and satiate your desires?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on July 03, 2010, 09:25:10 AM
However, what of newborn shadowlings, if the folks are so desirious of getting in a new colour, why not give one to a newborn Shadowling- that might cast light on some interesting aspect of the Shadowling society, possibly provide a side-quest, and satiate your desires?
Like a yellow shadowling version of Shabab (http://telepath.wikia.com/wiki/Shabab)?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: KZ on July 03, 2010, 10:18:24 AM
For instance, yes. Though I am not sure of the colour yellow- maybe orange (ie, just a tad more powerful than red), to signify how babies in general have rather high amounts of energy, and though they tire easily, an adult would have trouble keeping up with their high intensity. Then the newborns will "red" quickly with time, and then spend quite a lot of time in that stage. Though Shabab is quite old and to provide for a bit more variety methinks a newborn could be involved- this also migh shed light on the question of where do Shadowlings come from, so to speak.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Duskling on July 03, 2010, 12:30:36 PM
I mean that the EMP in the blast was strong enough to alter his/her DNA to make him yellow, but not so to make him fluent in Light attacks, I mean, a Shadowling with a Light attack would be ridiculous.
According to you and my time playing TPA2, tons of shadowlings should also have altered DNA.  I play with alot of shadowlings and they all took alot of light attacks.
But we haven't encountered any enemy Shadowlings in TSoG, have we?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on July 03, 2010, 02:30:46 PM
maybe orange (ie, just a tad more powerful than red), to signify how babies in general have rather high amounts of energy
I still don't see how color has anything to do with how powerful a shadowling is.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: KZ on July 04, 2010, 08:08:21 AM
You can read the finalised discussion on the old forums, for instance. The argument goes thus (also partly related to the shadowling anatomy, also discussed at length on the old forums): power is  energy transferred over time taken. Eneregy is proportional, via Plank's equation, to one over lambda, where the latter is the wavelength of electromagnetic radiation. Red has longest wavelength, blue has shortest wavelength. Therefore, blue is indicative of higher energy than red.  Going from red to blue, power increases. Now, as Craig put it many times, colur is indirect indication of age, and it can also be an indirect indication of power- same way as we judge people on sight, to guess how old and how physically strong they are- sometimes we're mistaken, but, generally, we do get a rough idea. This correlates well with Shadowling or human age because: as the Shadowlings mature, they become more powerful, going blue. When they reach old age, they start to weaken, hence they start to go green (ie less power).
Note that this is completely separate from what element the Shadowlings use to express their Psy abilities- there is a difference between what you're made up of and what you're able to manipulate.
Also, the alternative "colour wheel" simply fits the data but it no way explains why it is so. This is simply something art folks use, and I don't see how you can make a credible connection to the Shadowling physiology from it. Whilst the explanation above correlates the two factors very well, also fits the data, but can also explain it in a very credible manner.
As for the notable exceptions of Nelis and Tastidian: think of a difference between a light bulb and the stars, the difference in prinicples under which they operate and the different orders of magnitude in energy that they operate on, and yet note the similarities in application of the two processes the humans have found. Given that Nelis appears physically different and is much older than the rest of the Shadowlings, I wouldn't be at all suprised that her physiology is a bit different from the rest of the Shadowlings, whilst Tastidian being so powerul and Gifted might mean that some alternative processes kick in due to the need to conatin all that power within his Shadowling shell (think of anerobic respiration starting up when we require lots and lots of energy, versus typical aerobic respiration- same being, same "vessel", but completely different chemical reactions taking place, with different side effects).
Actually, I, for one, would like to see another glowing Shadolwing in Somnus, but working in some civilian capacity.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on July 04, 2010, 09:24:08 AM
Note that this is completely separate from what element the Shadowlings use to express their Psy abilities- there is a difference between what you're made up of and what you're able to manipulate..
But what they are made of doesn't effect their power.  Turning from Red to Purple would not effect a shadowling's ability to use their Shadow element.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: KZ on July 04, 2010, 10:07:44 AM
Well, surely age affects our ability to perform tasks, whether they be mental or physical? It just so happens that shadowlings tend to display both a crude indication of their age and their power in the colours they emit, which would then be indirectly related to how well they can manipulate their Gift. Think about it this way: a person's looks can give an observer a rough indication of their age and their bodily strength, which could make us deduce how well they'd be able to walk, lift things or in any other way engage their faculties. Now, the mental part is even less correlated in humans, though still generalizations are made- the logic process in children, for instance, onset of alzheimer's or dementia with old age, etc. Also, power is an additional tool, but not the core component of the ability to perform tasks - most can lift a grocery bag, but depending on their power, some can lift heavier bags, whilst others cannot. Same goes for Shadowlings- the more powerful Shadowling will be able to poerform a more devastating Shadow Blast, but that doesn't mean that a weaker Shadowling will be less adept at being able to manipulate the Shadow element, but without as much power put into it (ie power v skill, not mutually exclusive).
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on July 04, 2010, 05:48:01 PM
Well, surely age affects our ability to perform tasks, whether they be mental or physical?
Physical tasks; yes. Menal tasks; sort of.  (30, 40, and 50 year olds would have about the same difficultly doing mental tasks.)  Just because age effects ones ability to do a task, doesn't mean a color would effect it.  For example, would General Darkeye's ability to stay youthful and red make him less powerful then an aging purple shadowing?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: KZ on July 06, 2010, 03:09:10 PM
Methinks you're still missing the point I am trying to make: the colour is simply a facet of appearance that allows one to roughly gauge where the person's health (and ability to perform tasks) stands- thus, I'm saying that since "age affects ones abilty to do a task" and colour reflectes shadowlings age, it will reflect on the Shadowling's health/power/well being. But it is only a rough reflection- like judging people's strengths from their appearances, as it can be a very rough indicator of their age and strength.



Staiyng more on-topic, what think you of a new colour for a newborn Shadowling suggestion?
Given the light-power argument, I'd think that a newborn baby could be very healthy, highly energetic and therefore, possibly, quite orange, rather than fully red. Maybe a brick-red?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on January 09, 2011, 01:48:53 AM
What think you of a new color for a newborn Shadowling suggestion?
Given the light-power argument, I'd think that a newborn baby could be very healthy, highly energetic and therefore, possibly, quite orange, rather than fully red. Maybe a brick-red?
I was also thinking orange would work well for a young shadowling.


Somnus is being developed and I don't see any new colored shadowlings.  Based on the poll, many people will be disappointed.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: ArtDrake on January 09, 2011, 08:19:39 AM
I just want to point out that with the wavelength theory, the shadowlings experience a supreme jump in power as soon as they hit purple.

I think that most shadowlings don't glow, and it's more a matter of pigmentation and scattered versus absorbed light, rather than emitting or radiating.

Perhaps, like flamingos, shadowlings' colors differ based on what kinds of emotions they consume. If young shadowlings feed on anger, middle-age shadowlings feed on sadness, and the older shadowlings tend to like subtle ones like jealousy, envy, pity and the like, it might cause them to change color. The gradual shift of food preference would explain why Malis is purple; she might have just switched, or is slowly moving in on sadness, but hasn't quite made it her full diet.

All speculation...
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on January 09, 2011, 03:27:08 PM
I just want to point out that with the wavelength theory, the shadowlings experience a supreme jump in power as soon as they hit purple.
Are you saying that the wavelength theory is flawed because it would be unrealistic for the shadowling to jump from red to purple?

I think that most shadowlings don't glow, and it's more a matter of pigmentation and scattered versus absorbed light, rather than emitting or radiating.
So the shadowling are reflecting colors based off of their pigments vs emitting thier colored lights?  Having pigment would make more sense then shadowlings being colored lightbulbs.

Perhaps, like flamingos, shadowlings' colors differ based on what kinds of emotions they consume. If young shadowlings feed on anger, middle-age shadowlings feed on sadness, and the older shadowlings tend to like subtle ones like jealousy, envy, pity and the like, it might cause them to change color. The gradual shift of food preference would explain why Malis is purple; she might have just switched, or is slowly moving in on sadness, but hasn't quite made it her full diet.
In Somnus, a blue shadowling will feed off of the Hero's anger.  Plus, why would their diets change based on age? Also, Shadowlings don't only feed off of human emotions, so your theory would mean that there would be many colorless shadowlings who choose not to feed off of humans.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: bugfartboy on January 09, 2011, 04:58:37 PM
He's got a point. But how do shadowlings glow in a dark dark room?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: ArtDrake on January 09, 2011, 08:07:49 PM
They do?

And to im2smart4u, I admit that the diet thing was a bit less thought out than I would have liked. Still, I think pigmentation would be at least somewhat linked to diet, just like eating right keeps you healthy longer and looking younger into old age, and eating too much carrotene makes one's face somewhat discolored. Maybe some kinds of negative emotions are healthier than others... I don't think we'll never know. Unless we ask Craig and he's willing to answer.

And I'm also saying KZ's logic about the yellow shadowlings was flawed if he follows the wavelength theory, in that he says "Why would a dying shadowling be stronger than a young red shadowling?", but the same applies to a green shadowling.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on January 09, 2011, 11:17:31 PM
He's got a point. But how do shadowlings glow in a dark dark room?
When has a shadowling glowed in a dark room?

And to im2smart4u, I admit that the diet thing was a bit less thought out than I would have liked. Still, I think pigmentation would be at least somewhat linked to diet, just like eating right keeps you healthy longer and looking younger into old age, and eating too much carrotene makes one's face somewhat discolored. Maybe some kinds of negative emotions are healthier than others... I don't think we'll never know. Unless we ask Craig and he's willing to answer.
Diet has very little effect on skin color.  Eating massive amounts of carrots may turn you yellow (that happened to me as a baby) and eating massive amounts of tomatoes will turn you red, but those instances are extremely rare.  In most cares, you skin color is determinted by sun exposure and the pigment that your DNA tells your body to make.  Shadowlings probably produce different pigments as the shadowling bodies age.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: ArtDrake on January 10, 2011, 06:03:06 AM
Well it probably isn't sunlight that changes it...

But then again, there's still the eyes. Most humans' eyes don't change color, and the hands... they not even exactly attached. Maybe we're overthinking this.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: bugfartboy on January 10, 2011, 06:13:40 AM
Or maybe we're underthinking this. Do shadowlings need humans specifically o feed? Or will any mammal do?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: ArtDrake on January 10, 2011, 07:06:35 AM
Seeing as they constantly refer to humans as fleshlings in TRPG2, I thing any animal would do, and I'm sure a Shadowling wouldn't object to feeding off a Spriggat.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: bugfartboy on January 10, 2011, 05:08:58 PM
Animals have emotions. Sorta. They feel happy and sad. Just look at my dog as I left the house this morning for school. So you may not be wrong about the diet theory. Maybe the shadowlings that don't feed off of humans feed off of animals and still get their color.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: ArtDrake on January 10, 2011, 06:51:04 PM
Thank you. And my cat looks at me with what looks like a feeling of betrayal when I splash water on him (disciplinary uses, not cruelty).
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on January 10, 2011, 08:25:17 PM
I was saying that shadowling eat things other then emotions.  Niven eats pickles and many shadowlings comsume beer.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: bugfartboy on January 10, 2011, 08:27:06 PM
I was saying that shadowling eat things other then emotions.  Niven eats pickles and many shadowlings comsume beer.
Ah. Okay. Maybe they just eat those for pleasure rather than need. And a question. How does the shadowling digestive system work?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: ArtDrake on January 10, 2011, 08:53:50 PM
Well, the food goes in the mouth, and stays on the interior of the shadowling until the shadowsymes are done with it, at which point the consumed food becomes part of the plume. This process can be stinky, and the less refined shadowlings call it "spilling in your plume".
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on January 10, 2011, 08:54:34 PM
Lets get back on topic:  Is there a reason that two new people don't want too see newly colored shadowlings?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: ArtDrake on January 10, 2011, 09:13:31 PM
Oh, one was me, I think. How new?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: bugfartboy on January 10, 2011, 09:18:30 PM
Yeah. One was me too. I really don't think that a new color is needed.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on January 11, 2011, 09:59:28 AM
Yeah. One was me too. I really don't think that a new color is needed.
Did you not find talking to the green Lala interesting?  I found that the green shadowling peaked my interest, because she was so much different from the all of the other shadowlings, yet she explains how her color is not that unusual.  Wouldn't you want the same experience with an orange shaodwling in TSoG?
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: ArtDrake on January 11, 2011, 10:03:25 AM
I think that the shadowling colors are complete.

Honestly, when I met Lala, I didn't think twice about her color until my Hero mentioned it.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on January 11, 2011, 10:19:58 AM
Honestly, when I met Lala, I didn't think twice about her color until my Hero mentioned it.
What about Malis's coloring? You didn't find that interesting?  Personally, I was caught off guard when I saw her strange, purple coloring.  Her different coloring allows some funny jokes that made reference towards shadowling aging.  Like how Malis's purple coloring is making her have a mid-life crisis, it would be funny to see a young, cocky shadowling insist that he is an adult despite him being orange (Since many fomumers hate being looked down upon due to thier young age, many could relate to an orange shadowling).
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: Zackirus on January 11, 2011, 03:45:25 PM
Many Youth, not just forum goers, could relate to that shadowling as nobody likes getting looked down upon (or being told for that matter) by older people. Though it would be funny to see a small shadowling who tries to act all though towards the hero, and then his mother who tells him not be to rude to the guest (you).

Here is a quick dialogue I just thought up of:

Spoiler
1. Sneerling: [You see an orange shadowling which is substantially smaller than most other shadowling you've seen. A scan of his mind says that is only a child and that is name is Sneerling. He emanates arrogance rather strongly.] You think your so tough human by walkin' into my house, and leaving your markings on my floor. Who do ya think you are? Some sort of Deadly Warrior. I could eat you for breakfast and still have room for more. You wanna go buddy.

a. I never had any intention.... [Sends to 2]
b. Look junior, I can make you whimper in your own smoke cloud if I wanted to [Sends to 6]
c. [Leave] [Exits Conversation]

2. Sneerling: Ya right. You're so scared you're shaking in your... your... ah... (he points to your legs) whatever those are! You know it! All you humans are weak and pathetic and you're the weakest. After all, your just a foul, dirty, stupid, fleshing that has no dam....

Jadeling: [The light blue in the corner of the room speaks up, she has a high clear voice and by a scan he is Sneerling’s mother: Jadeling] Sneerling! What have I told you about using fowl language!
a. [Continue] [Sends to 3]

3. Sneerling: But Mom that thing is a Fles…

Jadeling: I don’t care who this is, that is not how you treat a guest.
a. [Continue] [Sends to 4]

4. Sneerling: Everyone does it though, all my friends say that…

Jadeling: You live in this house, and you will follow this houses rule until you move out of the house. Now go to your room before I ground you! (Sneerling quickly turns around and floats down the stairs)
a. [Continue] [Sends to 5]

5. Jadeling: I’m sorry about that, he can get over-confident and make rash decisions, I guess that’s what it means being a kid.
a. I guess your right [Exits Conversation]
b. Their more to being a kid, you just can’t see it [Exits Conversation]
c. Oh, I would know (wink) [Exits Conversation]

6. Sneerling: You think you’re so tough, I bet I could take you in a fight. After all you are just a dirty fleshling you no power what so ever.
a. Look I don’t want to hurt you... [Sends to 7]
b. I’ll just be leaving now [Exits Conversation]

7. Ha you're just a weak as my friends said humans are, now get outa my face before I make you leave, you disgusting animal (He Laughs). You sicken me and you have no purpose in this world.
a. So what, You are just a child[Sends to 8]
b. Leave me alone [Exits Conversation]

8. I am not a Child! (he sounds more flustered than angry) I am an adult that is capable of making their own decisions. I don't need someone to look after me, I can do it by myself. 
a. Whatever you say [Sends to 9]

9. I am, I am, I am (he starts to sound less adult like each I am). I don't need people like you coming in and saying I'm not an adult, what do you know about life and sacrifices.
a. More than you, now goodbye [Exits Conversation]

Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: bugfartboy on January 11, 2011, 03:51:23 PM
Hmm... I don't know what to say to that.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: cyso on January 11, 2011, 04:07:42 PM
That would be a rather interesting bit of dialogue. I wouldn't mind seeing something like that in the game.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: ArtDrake on January 11, 2011, 05:29:57 PM
I bothers me when dialogue tells of actions taking place, and the background shows something to the contrary. It's kind of bothersome when it's just things like Set's greeting not appearing behind the dialogue box, but when he flees the room after the whole doctor thing, he doesn't move. And I don't think that Craig would make a cutscene for something like that, something little.
Title: Re: New Shadowling Colors
Post by: SmartyPants on December 09, 2011, 06:57:18 PM
(http://s11.postimage.org/p4f41eyjz/Shadowling_Orange.png) (http://postimage.org/) => (http://s10.postimage.org/l7113hqhx/Shadowling_Red.png) (http://postimage.org/) => (http://s7.postimage.org/njdau4pvb/Shadowling_Purple.png) (http://postimage.org/) =>

(http://s9.postimage.org/absiy2aiz/Shadowling_Blue.png) (http://postimage.org/) => (http://s11.postimage.org/sgi08gfov/Shadowling_Green.png) (http://postimage.org/) => (http://s7.postimage.org/rfv83v08n/Shadowling_Yellow.png) (http://postimage.org/)