The Sinister Design Forums

Games => TRPG2 => Topic started by: Bromtaghon on July 02, 2010, 04:01:30 PM

Title: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Bromtaghon on July 02, 2010, 04:01:30 PM
When faced with the choice between Helena and Flint, and 500 Gold, which did you pick?
I found 500 Gold to be worth more: Flint's mobility really means his powerful attacks rarely get used.  Helena is pretty much a weaker version of Gamblin' Jack, who I've trained a lot by that point.  Whirlwind is hardly helpful as either there aren't enough enemies for it to be useful, or there are too many and she'll end up dieing- in other words, it's a kamikaze suicide attack.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Zackirus on July 02, 2010, 04:11:39 PM
I don't really use Flint and Helena that much but I still choose them to be on my team. Why? because I am a completionlist. Even though something might not be useful to be I still get it just to have it.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Bromtaghon on July 02, 2010, 04:32:38 PM
I agree- the first time, I did it, the second time, I realized I didn't use them at all, so I ditched them in the Deeper Downs.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Steelfist on July 02, 2010, 05:32:06 PM
I find that if you use the steam engine for Flint he becomes fairly mobile, so I get them. Just for Flint.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: SmartyPants on July 02, 2010, 05:53:57 PM
It is easy to get back 500 gold, but you only get one chance to hire Helena and Flint.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Bromtaghon on July 02, 2010, 06:03:56 PM
I agree.  Gold can be regained, but orbs/teammates can't.  However, when it's a teammate I rarely find useful, such as Helena or Flint, I'd rather take the gold, not because it's scarce but because it's more useful.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: KZ on July 03, 2010, 08:31:46 AM
Always hired them, since you get only one shot at doing so, whilst getting extra 500 gold is very simply and there is more than one way, at any time to re-gain it. I use Helena quite a lot during the mission 4-5 stretch, whilst Flint I use on occaison to liven things up a litte- and it is rather ironic that he is, ultimately, the fastest character you have on your team (max speed 13, I believe, with steam engine and capacitor). In any way, it's worth keeping them as alternatives, just in case the player gets bored or decides to change strategy.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Tastidian on July 07, 2010, 09:32:35 PM
I just used flint as a giant wall that destroys stuff and eventually as my most fastest member.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: cx on July 08, 2010, 01:16:51 PM
I've hired Helena and Flint always but rarely used Flint and Helena is good at battle against Cerzak's minions and at battles against Academy/Shadowlings
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Zhampir on July 08, 2010, 01:47:07 PM
I've always hired them (except the first time through I didn't have the money :-\)
I tend to opt out on having any shadowlings in my crew. Just to spite the queen... or if I used them I'd send them off in suicide attacks... I'd use festus though. Helena and Gamblin Jack make a good team. and Flint... well... he's just unstoppable.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Barzul on July 08, 2010, 02:09:49 PM
But she takes the money from the bug queen battle... how could you not have that?
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Bromtaghon on July 08, 2010, 08:42:48 PM
He probably thought he'd have to pay up immediately, I did the first time.
I don't use Helena and  :-\, as in, ever, because I have seven teammates more useful than them, so I keep the money.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: KZ on July 11, 2010, 04:43:16 AM
I don't use Helena and  :-\, as in, ever, because I have seven teammates more useful than them, so I keep the money.
So, in what ways are the other teammates more useful? (Just curious. I also seem to recall a very old poll which showed that although people did find using Flint amusing for a short while, an not as a regular teammate, mostly due to his slow upstart in any battle, even with Steam Engine, with everyone basing arguments in "buy them or leave them" polls around Helena's usefulness instead.)
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Bromtaghon on July 12, 2010, 11:28:16 AM
I never use Flint because he's too slow- Steam Engine is bugged for me, just like Jack's Recover.  So by the time he gets to the front to use his attacks, the battle's over already.  If Steam Engine worked I suppose I'd use him more often...
Helena, she's pretty much a clone of Jack and I only need one swordsman, especially during the Lake Alto mission.  Jack is much stronger by then, he also has Mind Shield and Snake Eyes, I'm pretty sure Fury was bugged when I used it too, and I dislike Whirlwind.  Area attacks do less damage then more concentrated attacks, and enemies who don't die can easily surround and kill her next turn.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: cx on July 12, 2010, 11:53:24 AM
On my party Helena is finisher on brutal at Lake Alto when others took enemies HP down enough so Whirlwind killed enemies around her (2-3 enemies) and at Academy-battle after party gets to advance, never used Fury since either no time to use it (enemy could have killed Helena on next round) or enemy's hp was low enough to kill with normal attack.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Dorgon 5000 on July 13, 2010, 02:36:21 AM
I think Flint and Helena are good. Flint is good at the start, but Helena gets stronger after very many upgrades (with one of my characters, I gave her atk. level 59, and she suddenly was more effective even than Jack.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: cx on July 13, 2010, 11:10:14 AM
she suddenly was more effective even than Jack.

Jack's Snake Eyes tend to vary too much, sometimes its 40+ and sometimes 20+.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Duskling on July 21, 2010, 05:36:28 PM
I always choose Flint and Helena, as the gold is easily wasted on training, and just as easily gained back in fights, with them you only get one chance. Plus Whirlwind is pretty cool, and hunting for repair parts makes you a bit more alert.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Tastidian on July 31, 2010, 11:04:58 PM
There is a lot of gold in TRPG2 but only one Helena and Flint
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: MikeW781 on August 02, 2010, 03:50:12 PM
A good summary of the reasons for choosing Helena and Flint
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: bugfartboy on August 02, 2010, 08:34:54 PM
Helena+Flint

And:
Spoiler
If you have Magnilus at your disposal, 500 gold can easily be regained by replacing the Spriggat Assasins Boss Battle.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: lordnova on August 19, 2010, 07:30:08 AM
i will hired them  you could use them for samething else like helena with her sword skill flint for me would do nothing
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: KZ on August 30, 2010, 08:53:24 AM
What would be interesting to hear is for those who do not hire Flint and Helena, what are their reasons for doing so (after all, reasons for hiring them have been stated aplenty in these two pages)?
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Xemadus Echina on August 30, 2010, 09:20:08 AM
in one game that i played I went through the game to see how few team mates i could gather.  I never did finish that one...
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Ertxiem on August 31, 2010, 05:02:54 AM
In the old forums, somebody claimed that he could finish TRPG2 without grinding for money (no random battles, no bronze golem battles and no Malignus battles). For that to happen, he wouldn't hire Helena and Flint and saved the money for training his team (I believe that he didn't buy Gamblin' Jack either). That's the only case where it makes sense to me to not get Helena and Flint.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: KZ on August 31, 2010, 05:23:30 AM
Indeed, I was thinking of that time too. In fact, that person only used the 3 Shadowlings and the Main to complete the whole game. But he noted that it became very-very hard towards the end. Apart from this minimalist approach, I also cannot think of any other reason not to get Helena and Flint, hence me wondering why people don't take them onboard.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Xemadus Echina on August 31, 2010, 04:24:49 PM
well going with the minimalist approach, which units must you recruit to continue the game and which ones are purely optional? and which ones is it possible to "scare away"?
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Barzul on August 31, 2010, 04:38:31 PM
Shadowling, Darkling, Festus, Anya, and Guy are the only ones required that you get, and Anya and Guy can be scared off if you side with the shadowlings. All the others can be ignored or rejected.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Ertxiem on August 31, 2010, 05:24:33 PM
And you don't even need to use (or train) all team mates that you get.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: MikeW781 on August 31, 2010, 06:22:51 PM
I played on addicting games first, and in that one you can only save your main's progress as far as New Game +'s go, so I had a really high level main (like, no sweat with solo brutal) and spent everything on him. On the special version, I train everybody.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: KZ on September 01, 2010, 08:49:38 AM
Indeed, I guess when one tries the minimalist approeach out of prinicple, then Helena and Flint can be neglected. In fact, I do remember someone trying to play the entire game with just the Main, but I am not sure if they managed to finish it or not- they definitely managed to get through the first 5 missions or so though, if memory serves me right.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Xemadus Echina on September 01, 2010, 10:51:24 AM
well if you horribly abused that old glitch/secret where you could get money off of the out of game random battles then you could get the main lvled up so far that nothing could kill him.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Ertxiem on September 01, 2010, 02:00:37 PM
I guess KZ was talking about someone soloing all the game (from a fresh start) without playing the random battles (and without taking advantage from glitches).
I managed to solo beat the first mission on brutal. After that I grinded a bit to make things easier and won all the battles solo, including Nelis. However, due to bugs in some missions, I had to put some team mate in the roster in order to play them (usually one of the shadowlings because they are fast enough to be placed far away from the enemies and not be targeted by the AI).
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: KZ on September 01, 2010, 04:30:28 PM
Ert has it spot-on. Nothing to do with exploiting glitches. Given the number of run-throughs of TRPG2 I did during the beta-testing stage, I never got around to soloing it in the end, but found a couple of funky challenges in any case.


To sum up the topic at hand- there is no good reason not to sign on Helena and Flint, unless purely out of principle (such as having a run-through with minimum number of players).
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: lordnova on September 01, 2010, 04:58:33 PM
I well buy them because flint have neat skill.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: HeadShot on December 18, 2010, 06:21:45 PM
I hire Helena And  :-\ (Flint), but I mainly use flint.

Spoiler
Flint can learn Steam Engine, Fire Breath, and Spin Saw. That Is The Reason I use  :-\ (Flint)
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: cyso on December 18, 2010, 06:40:22 PM
I always employed Helena and Flint, but now that I think about it, I never really used either of them. I guess I just didn't want to leave them there. Plus, 500 gold didn't seem too much of a price to pay.
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: ArtDrake on December 20, 2010, 08:32:22 PM
Ditto! I felt a moral obligation...
Title: Re: Helena + Flint vs. 500 Gold
Post by: Shadoroq on February 03, 2011, 08:42:23 PM
I would hire them for fear of death the first few times I played. After that, I was just "Screw it. I don't need you guys, go die in a bug pit for all I care." Nowadays I just pwn everything solo with my lvl. 111 main.