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What are Spirits made of

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Steelfist:
I would refute this theory; spirits are in fact invisible, and a super dense liquid would at least distort the air, and would be visually detectable. Actually, I would say that the spirit is composed of pure psy, whose emanations are interpreted by Duvalier as a glowing form (As it is a purely non-visual experience represented in a visual way, it can look wierd or inexplicable).

The spirit being affected by physical attacks could be because of latent psy talent; I suspect that most people within the telepath world have psy power, of varying degrees, which probably goes unnoticed. But, because the person intends to attack the spirit, and believe they can harm the spirit, they focus their latent psy power subconciously, and do attack the spirit with their mind, without realising it is a mental attack. Because it isn't a proper psy attack, it's not as effective as one, resulting in the 'physical resistance' possessed by spirits.

The physical attack in fact does nothing, and a poorly focused psy attack causes a little damage.

Chocobo_Fan:
That does sound more plausible...but then, how do you explain how greater ghosts are completely immune to physical attacks?

And also, if that's the case, we come back to the problem of how Rajav is able to physically attack things with a spectral spear.

(It also seems odd that spirits appear to have material possessions... Luca is clearly in a dress, and Rajav has a cape and shield in addition to his spear, all of which have in the same spirit texture. Perhaps it is because the image spirits project is linked to their own self-perception? So they would look like they view themselves, clothes and possessions included.)

Oh, and, uh, sorry for derailing my own thread, Ert.

Steelfist:

--- Quote from: Chocobo_Fan on February 25, 2012, 04:18:40 PM ---That does sound more plausible...but then, how do you explain how greater ghosts are completely immune to physical attacks?

--- End quote ---
Perhaps the less focused and controlled blast can be diverted, with sufficient power and skill.


--- Quote from: Chocobo_Fan on February 25, 2012, 04:18:40 PM ---And also, if that's the case, we come back to the problem of how Rajav is able to physically attack things with a spectral spear.

--- End quote ---

The spear could be manupulated with telekinesis (He might not even be aware of this, as it may be subconcious), or his spear could be non-corporeal, but the space that it occupies becomes very, very cold (Thanks to spiritual cyro affinity), producing a physical effect. Or, possibly, his 'body' consists of a psy shield, and psy shields can react with the physical world.


--- Quote from: Chocobo_Fan on February 25, 2012, 04:18:40 PM ---(It also seems odd that spirits appear to have material possessions... Luca is clearly in a dress, and Rajav has a cape and shield in addition to his spear, all of which have in the same spirit texture. Perhaps it is because the image spirits project is linked to their own self-perception? So they would look like they view themselves, clothes and possessions included.)

--- End quote ---

I think so, yes. I mean, it would make a lot of sense, and I can't really think of an alternative.

fourinone:

--- Quote from: SmartyPants on February 24, 2012, 11:04:58 PM ---I always imagined that spirits were like a highly dense liquid held together by the spirit's psy defence.  Physical attacks would not cause real damage to a spirit's liquid body, but it would disrupt the spirit's ability to hold itself together.

--- End quote ---

I like this theory, that a spirit is held together by a mind shield. As we know, a mind shield can be affected by both physical and psy attacks. And when the mind shield breaks, the spirit dissipates. Perhaps, though, the theory doesn't require that the spirit be composed of a dense liquid; it doesn't matter what it's made of (whether it's liquid, pure psy, or something else) as long as the mind shield surrounding it is tangible. As for the weapon, if we assume it's also ethereal, perhaps the mind shield around it is harder? Set is able to create a highly durable solid state shield, right?


--- Quote from: SteelFist on February 25, 2012, 03:26:01 PM ---The spirit being affected by physical attacks could be because of latent psy talent; I suspect that most people within the telepath world have psy power, of varying degrees, which probably goes unnoticed. But, because the person intends to attack the spirit, and believe they can harm the spirit, they focus their latent psy power subconciously, and do attack the spirit with their mind, without realising it is a mental attack. Because it isn't a proper psy attack, it's not as effective as one, resulting in the 'physical resistance' possessed by spirits.

--- End quote ---

My problem with this explanation is that it assumes that the 50% reduction of physical damage is a uniform property of all potential attackers, whereas it being a property of the spirits themselves is far more likely. As you said, people in the telepath world have psy powers of varying degree. Surely Duvalier, a talented psy, would (subconsciously or not) deal a higher percentage of damage with a knife than Qudssi, a man with little to no psy abilities?


Allow me to suggests another theory. This theory assumes that the spirit is merely an intangible disembodied mind of a deceased human. Spirits are entities which cling to their former lives, so much of the habits and brain functions from their lives may remain. When a spirit is attacked by a physical weapon, its mind still thinks it's being harmed, so it may shut down or die from shock. Pulling a quote from the Matrix, "your mind makes it real". It's somewhat like a placebo. Of course, this is less effective than actually being wounded by a weapon, so only half damage is taken. Greater ghosts, which have been spirits for a long time, may have forgotten much of their humanity, no longer associating being struck with something harmful, thus making them immune. (This may also be why the heads of greater ghosts are skulls: they have forgotten their humanity and now perceive themselves as such.)
Also note that for this theory to work, their weapons would have to be real, and wielded with telekinesis.

Ertxiem:

--- Quote from: Chocobo_Fan on February 25, 2012, 04:18:40 PM ---That does sound more plausible...but then, how do you explain how greater ghosts are completely immune to physical attacks?

And also, if that's the case, we come back to the problem of how Rajav is able to physically attack things with a spectral spear.

(It also seems odd that spirits appear to have material possessions... Luca is clearly in a dress, and Rajav has a cape and shield in addition to his spear, all of which have in the same spirit texture. Perhaps it is because the image spirits project is linked to their own self-perception? So they would look like they view themselves, clothes and possessions included.)

Oh, and, uh, sorry for derailing my own thread, Ert.

--- End quote ---

Greater ghosts could be immune to physical attacks because they could be able to maintain intact their idea of themselves, even when a physical weapon is crossing through their imagined position of their body. (An alternative explanation was the ability of greater ghosts to make an opening in the path of the weapon.)

If the spirits' psy powers are able to modify air, they would also be able to act upon physical objects and living creatures. So, I can understand that a spirit may be able to move a chair or punch a person. Of course, if they want to attack someone, it may be easier to use their psy powers directly (in a mind blast, for instance).

(I agree with the ideas in your parenthesis.)

No problem. It's fun when ideas grow and follow new paths.

No problem. When ideas start to grow, sometimes they follow their own path.

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